Guys, I had the Kenwood 719DVD (I think it was called) and now it has broken and I need a new unit. It worked the same way as the new 8120 unit which they recommend. Two dealers that I've talked to both really, REALLY try to tell me that the are having a lot of problems with the Pioneers and one dealer says all units that they've installed have had to be pulled out to be serviced but they are really pleased with the Kenwoods.

For most part, I was happy with my Kenwood with the exception of a few minor issues. THey also say that the Pioneers are real hard to use compared to the Kenwood. ARe there people here that have had both that can compare? I really would like to hear from users of both and not just people that have had Pioneer.

I like the fact that you can dial a phone number directly off the NAV screen. I like the voice recognition for the music if it works well. Do you have to rip something in the unit for it to work or will simply copying your music over to the HD make the voice recognition of the names of artists or songs work?

Another thing that intrigues me on the pioneer is the 12 million POI's vs the 6 million for the Kenwood.

OTher than the obvious, the numbers, IS there any practical difference there?

Finally, is there anyone near me (close to Charlotte, NC) that has a Z3 that wouldn't mind showing it to me? I'd be happy to take you out to lunch or dinner at the same time.

Finally, how is the warranty and service and do you guys have any quality problems?

Also, what's the biggest HD you can put in the unit (for more music space) and what is the 400 album limitation?

I would really appreciate a quick response as I want to get this done next week.

One more thing. I do not watch video on this thing and I won't be connecting an ipod to it. Other brand mp3 player or PVP maybe but not ipod. So the video is no biggie for me. The Bluetooth however is. I use the bluetooth all the time and the possibility to dial by voice has me salivating, especially IF it works well. On my LG VX9800 it worked beautifully and if it works as well here, I would be very happy NOT having to look for a number while I drive which by the way is stupid as hell

Thanks

George

well i cant anwser everything but can some things. the only way to get music on the hdd drive of the z3 is ripping. there is not copying over to the HD. the voice recognition on mine was ok but i just couldnt get into useing it alot. was faster for me to find the song.

Ripping is out of the question since I don't have my music on CD's so that's one down.

As for the voice recognition. If it is setup and works correctly, it SHOULD be easy to use so if not, that;s another one down.

I WAS going to go with the kenwood due to the recommendations but I've always been intrigued by the Z series so I wanted to check anyway.

There are a couple of days left so I'll wait for more comments just in case.

Thanks

George

George, I've been looking at the same two units along with the new JVC KW NX7000 - I've been trying to locate them at a local shop so I could play with them. Only one I've found so far as a Z3. I played with it yesterday for about 20 minutes and I don't know...I wasn't really pleased with the screen quality (resolution) of the NAV maps - very old VGA looking stuff - there was an F servies 700BT right next to it and its NAV image was WAY better - kinda like comparing regular TV to HD TV...

Also, I really found that using the NAV was not very straight forward on it... I'm a computer programmer, I right software and websites with navigtion properties, menus, etc... and the Z3 just wasn't intuitive to use...I also found the touchscreen to not work real well...you sometimes had to press multiple times to get it to work and press pretty hard - a light tap wouldn't register... and response time seemed really slow.

On a plus note, I did like the NAV voice - real person voice and easy to understand whereas I think the Kenwood has some fake robotic sounding voice for navigation. The bottom of the screen is very hard to tap the buttons too, because of the way Pioneer made the bottom of the unit that holds the buttons - it actually sticks out and is not flush as you would think by looking at pictures of the unit - thus I couldn't touch NAV buttons located right on the bottom of the screen unless I bent my finger and tried to tap them with the tip of my fingernail...

AND, I also found that it didn't recognize a lot of roads..>??? doesn't the Z3 have the latest NAV database? This thing didn't even have any of the roads in my city, subdivision - our streets have been here for 2 years and even show on google maps, but the Z3 didn't even show the roads...very odd....

Just my observations. I was set on the Z3, but after playing with it yesterday, now I don't know...I've got to find the Kenwood somewhere and play with it to compare...

Where are you located? We have plenty of kenwood dealers in my area (Charlotte, NC)

I can speak volumes about the navigation on the kenwood as I really liked it. I did have problems in certain areas and here too it didn't find streets in subdivisions several years old. I guess this is a general thing with these nav units or the maps. Either that or their info is really old.

The graphics on these things ARE really shi*ty and mine wasn't better but I think that possibly they do it for the simplicity of things and in order not to make things harder to see. I don't know but I don't like it either. Now, my unit was fast in responding and responded well to the touch. It's also super easy to use and I don't remember using the manual at all or almost not at all so I guess they are right about the Pioneer being harder to use.

My memory is so shot to hell, I don't remember now but I think my unit had a regular voice and not a synthesized one. I at least had no problems with it.

MP3 handling was poor but they say they have improved it this year on the new unit. It would only recognize 256 songs per folder but it seems now it's pretty much limitless. Good as this was an issue for me.

Also, on the old unit, if you went back to the list of songs, it would take you back to the first one which means if you wanted to scroll down, you had to do it screen by screen of 6 songs at the time AND that was slow. So, if you wanted to scroll down to around 200, you were screwed. They seem to have improved that with a sliding bar (check this link).

By the way, I just looked at the video and it seems the ipod handling is good but not sure how it is when you connect and mp3 player over the USB which IS different, especially if it's not ipod. This is what I did so I guess I still dont' know if it's improved or not.

Also looking at the video, it seems that the change of screens IS faster.

Another thing I was told they improved is the back button. In some cases on the old unit you could not back out all the way where you came from but had to go to a different menu. My local guy told me that now you can which is good.

I have to say that I really liked my kenwood for most part and especially the way the nav worked when everything was working so personally, I highly recommend that part. Like I said, I was looking at the Z3 for feature reasons but hell, if getting all these features comes at the expense of a unit that works so, so, it's not worth it

George

I'm in Idaho - I've still got to get to a shop and play with the Kenwood - I'd like to play the the AVIC again too and see if it was just "me" having issues.. I like the "hackability" of the F series, but it just sucks to have a small screen and round knobs..I know, kinda picky, but my bimmer doesn't have any round knobs, so this thing would stick out like a soar thumb, and I want to look as OEM as possible...

Personally, I prefer a knob for the volume but like the guy in the store said, it takes up screen space

Mine's being installed as we speak I hope...left my truck there today

Let me know if you want my number or anything if you need to ask questions about the 8120 which is what I'm getting

How's the 8120? How does the Nav do?? also, does it do 2d and 3d graphics and can you change the perspective on them like the pioneer - also wondering if the 8120 can show the lane mode as to which lanes you should be in like the Pioneers..

Stand buy, I had it typed up but dont know what happened.

I'll be back....

George

Man, I can’t believe I had all these questions answered and just forgot to click submit or something. I am soo stupid 

Anyway, as for 2 and 3d, I’m not sure if that option is there but I haven’t looked. I guess I’ll have to see but I don’t think there is an option.

As for the lane mode, not sure what you mean but let me tell you what the kenwood does. If you are on a highway and say it splits up ahead, it WILL tell you to keep to the left so that you are prepared and don’t have to freak out at the last moment and swerve. Especially important around here (and I assume in the rest of the US) because signage is REALLY POOR. I’ve missed many exits because the signs are right where you turn and not a little in advance.

Also, if you say take an off ramp to a different road and shortly after that you have to take another ramp or keep to the left because the road splits up, it DOES tell you and it’s one of the best features of this unit. Like I said before, I think the NAV is its best feature and I always loved it with very few exceptions.

Now, I got some kind of rearview camera which I don’t particularly like, especially since they said the picture was great. However, it does the job and it works adequately at night in the dark when you have the reverse lights on.

The graphics are a little better and the new background is cooler but that’s about it. Changing modes SEEMS to take longer now which sucks but above all, what is really F*cked up is that now, if it doesn’t change fast enough for you (at least I DO this), you tend to press one more time which puts the command in a queue and now you freak the machine the hell out and it can take forever before it catches up and till then, you can’t interrupt it or break the command chain so to speak. Ie, if you happen to press several commands, it could take 30 seconds or more for it to catch up so be very careful.

The Bluetooth which is now built in has IMPROVED features but not sure about the functionality or sound. The phone calls I’ve made were a disaster as people couldn’t hear me, they told me I’m breaking up and at times, I’m not sure if they even hear me as I ask them stuff and I get no reply. My old Bluetooth which was a separate unit worked beautifully. The guy blamed it on the iphone BUT, it’s been out for two years now AND, it worked beautifully on my old unit.

The Bluetooth/handsfree is the second most important function for me, the nav being number one so this WILL have to work or I’ll buy a used model of the old ones and I’ll take this back and god knows I’ll save a lot of money.

On the old unit, to transfer your contacts from the phone you had to do it ONE by one, this apparently AUTOMATICALLY transfers AND updates all your contacts as soon you as you connect the phone. Very cool as it already had everything transferred and I didn’t even know it.

So far, it has disconnected the Bluetooth several times and I’m not sure why.

You can teach the system the pronunciation of any name and store it so the system knows what you’re saying and you can use voice dial. Pretty cool if it didn’t have a problem picking up your voice which my system seems to have. Again, we’ll see how this works out. I intend to get my Bluetooth to work, even if I have to go back to the old model.

The voice for the nav (when it calls directions out) now has ONE volume setting as opposed to the old one which had TWO in two different locations which was bullshit so that’s improved.

So, do I like the new unit better? Yes and no. Yes if I can get everything working and if not, NO.

The MP3 handling is SOMEWHAT improved but still clunky and it seems that that part was designed by the same idiots that voted for Obama 

Ok, more questions?

George

Sounds good - let me know if you find anymore cool features on the NAV and what ends up happening with the Bluetooth - those are the two most important features I need as well..I may end up trying the Z3 - one thing I really liked was the rich feature set in the NAV such as the split screen maps - 2d/3d adjustable perspective and the 6 multiple routes to choose from - very cool...

Well, keep in mind that some features may seem cool but you may not use them such as the split screen and all the other stuff. Bottom line, if it gets too crowded you won't see it and remember, you ARE looking at this when you are driving so you don't need complicated or distractions.

One thing I dont' like on this system is the difficulty in going someplace but avoiding a certain road or route.

Also, I don't know if there is any way to replay the last trip/route and so on. When I think of the stuff I could make up and cram into these things that would be useful, I just want to cry considering how much we pay for this shi* and a simple program on your pc does so much more

I'll keep you posted.

George

I was out today and made many calls with the bluetooth and iphone and nothing but problems. Around 8 out of 10 calls I had problems with and people couldn't hear me. To confirm on a couple of occasions when they couldn't hear me, I stopped and redialed and talked through the phone instead with NO problems.

The dude that installed it thought it was MY responsibility to fix it and go online and look for fixes, updates and so on because as he says, all their customers have problems with the iphones. I pointed out that my previous unit worked beautifully with it but no dice. By the way, as a phone, the iphone IS a piece of shi* but it worked great with my handsfree before.

So, I called the store manager and told him that at around 2 grand, I didn't think I should have to trouble shoot it and I pointed out that it worked great before which really surprised him but it really did.

Anyway, there is a 2D and 3D although I can't really tell the difference and I'm not sure it's what you think it is.

I see some improvements over the way the NAV does things including one an icon showing up with the speed limit on one of the roads I was one. Never seen that before but it's very cool.

Another improvement is that when it shows you your NEXT turn for instance to the right, it shows this as a coming OFF the existing road. Ie, it shows the road you're on and the turn off. Before it only showed which direction you're turning. This new thing is better as it gives you a little better understanding of what the road will look like when you turn.

I still have problems getting it to go a certain way and NOT the way it wants me to go but there's no change there.

God, i would soo much love to hack this thing and get some improvements made. This is SOO stone age it's not funny but sadly, it's apparently the best thing out there.

George

also even tho the pioneer has 12 million POI and the kenwood has 6 million POI i was able to find much more of my POI on the kenwood which were more accurate and up to date.

yeah, I was trying to figure that one out and I'm thinking that maybe Pioneer has a lot of useless stuff or something...?