I know this subject has been discussed numerous times, and there is at least one work around I have read about (foam on the mic); however, after spending quite a while with Pioneer's helpless desk and driving the guy crazy with the echo (yes, I called them from the Hummer), the final decision was it was my phone. (Not sure if I believe this, since no one receives and echo when I use a logitech Bluetooth headphone.)
However, what I'm trying to find out is has anyone experienced this echo, and replaced the phone and the echo disappears?

I'm using an LG 8100 on Verizon.

hummer_h3 said:

I know this subject has been discussed numerous times, and there is at least one work around I have read about (foam on the mic); however, after spending quite a while with Pioneer's helpless desk and driving the guy crazy with the echo (yes, I called them from the Hummer), the final decision was it was my phone. (Not sure if I believe this, since no one receives and echo when I use a logitech Bluetooth headphone.)
However, what I'm trying to find out is has anyone experienced this echo, and replaced the phone and the echo disappears?

I'm using an LG 8100 on Verizon.

this was my experience:

I called my home using my wife's cell (Samsung A920) and she answered on the land line phone....no echo...

I called her cell (Samsung A920) using my cell (PPC-6700 from Sprint) and she said there was an echo...

so, it's either my cell phone or it's cell to cell that's causing an echo.

will try calling from her cell to my cell and see what happens and calling from my cell to the home land line.

let you know later today when I get home from work.

Try moving the Pioneer microphone around the cabin, avoiding pointing the mic towards the car's speakers. Also try setting the voice to come out of only left or right speakers and see how that works. Trial and error, trial and error...

try lowering your phone volume on the head unit from 3 to 3 and a half bars....depending on what vehicle this is, the microphone might be a little to close to the speakers therefore you will get an acho......try putting the mic as far away from the speakers as possible but not to far from you..later

Just spent over an hour today working on this, with a person who helped set up the Onstar system for GM. With the mic positioned on the left visor:
Left spkr off, right spker on, cell phone volume all the way down, NAV phone volume as low as it can go and still hear a conversation at 50 mph, echo is very slight and not a big problem
Right spker off, left spker on, same settings as above, echo is terrible
same with both spkrs.
Moved mic to passenger visor, and with right spkr off, left spker on, echo is low,
left spkr off, right spkr on, echo is terrible.

Move the mic to the ledge just in front of my I/P cluster, and it actually cut down on the echo even with all spkrs on.

Her conclusion, based on the research GM did on the Onstar system, and her Masters Degree in Electrical Engineering, there are two ways to go for Pioneer.
One, a sound canceling mic with directional capabilities, or better yet, a highly directional mic, that has to be placed in a position that aims it directly at the face of the person talking.
I guess this was a problem GM had with Onstar, versus position of the speakers in a vehicle, and location of the mic in the rearview mirror or above the driver's head. In the original systems, this echo was common, in later systems, echo is non-existent. However, GM spend big bucks to research and design the right mic for the different applications.
I sent this information to Pioneer and guess we will see what happens.

I was quite honest in my email. When I trade in the Hummer next year for another Hummer, I will either go with the factory unit and use Onstar, or I will go with another brand that has spent some money on mic research and development. However, if my problem (and everyone else's) is fixed by a new mic (which I would be willing to pay for), then Pioneer would be high on my list.

As it is, I will drive around with only the right speaker on, place my mic on the edge in front of the I/P cluster (it is indented from the front, so I'm guessing the side on the right helps to shield it a bit), and hopefully, I will not pee off too many people.

Funny, along the same lines i was investigating the specs on the Mic the other user on the forum used from the Parrot kit... He claims there is NO echo anymore with this mic.... Turns out the mic is directional.... hard thing is finding the microphone....

But, based on the notion that a directional or super-directional microphone is likely the way to go.... i went looking for a directional microphone on the web that would be suitable for in car installation and easy to drive...

I found (and purchased) a Nokia HFM-8 microphone... the specs indicate that it is directional and the low-profile look should work nicely in the car.... Look for it on Ebay.

I have tried the stock mic with the Z1.....BAD echo
I have tried the Motorola mic from my old bluetooth car kit (which worked great without any echo)... Echo as well with the Z1.

Both these mics were non-directional.... i'm hopeful for the Nokia...

I'll let you guys know how the experiment turns out....

http://cgi.ebay.com/New-OEM-Nokia-Repla ... dZViewItem

Yes, please do keep us informed. I will be curious if this mic will work in the NAV and cut out the echo.
I did some more playing around today. Taking the mic out of the vehicle and having the peson on the other end talk...no echo.
I believe the reason they use dirctional mic is so that others in the vehicle can carry on the conversation. Noise cancelling mics are more expensive, so I guess Pioneer does not want to spend the money.

i just hooked up my parrot mic an that thing worked flawlessly no echo what so ever. I'm getting another one for my 2nd z1 that Im getting next week :D :D

grcplaya

From what I understand, Pioneer had fixed the echo issue.

I called parrot and of course they told me that it was just a regular cheap mic and that the noise filter and stuff was in the unit not the mic. Whatever...anyway he said that he could send one out to me if I really wanted one, but what I want to know is what kind of adapter do I need to plug it into the Z1? I know the parrot mic is a 2.5 jack, but I don't know what the Z1 is. I'm assuming the adapter is one that converts a 2.5 jack to a 3.5 jack. I also heard that the Z1's jack is the same size in length as the typical jack whatever size it is.

grcplaya said:

i just hooked up my parrot mic an that thing worked flawlessly no echo what so ever. I'm getting another one for my 2nd z1 that Im getting next week :D :D

grcplaya

Can you give us some more information such as:
Model Number
Where to purchase
Does it require an adapter and where to get the adapter

Thanks

DataAve said:

From what I understand, Pioneer had fixed the echo issue.

I got one of the latest Bluetooth models and even Pioneer agrees, the issue is not fixed.

alright you guys here's the scoop my friend works for verizon and he got me a mic that was in the parrot CK3100 kit. I also told him that I needed another for my 2nd Z1 he said he could get me another, then I mentioned if I could get more he said he probably could get them but I have to wait til next week see what happens and maybe I could sell them for 20-30bux. but I would give parrot a call and see if they can send you a free one, you can't do better than that.!
as for the adapter I bought it at radioshack it was 3bux.
its a mono plug adapter(accepts 1/8"mini phone plug)(fits a 3/32" submini phone jack) the part # on the box is 274-327c

grcplaya

Ok...so just to be sure, does that mean the jack size on the Z1 is 2.5mm(3/32")?

I called parrot and asked about the microphone. The guy said I could order one for $7.50 which includes shipping or you can pay an extra $20 for overnight shipping. It's possible you could get it for free if you tell him you want to replace it as if you already have one or the kit, because he asked if I wanted an additional mic or to replace it. That's when I told him I didn't have one, but that I just wanted the mic. Also it's possible that you won't need the adapter. If you ask for a mic for the 3100 kit, it's 3.5mm jack and the 3200 kit is a 2.5mm jack or vice-versa.

yes its a 2.5mm jack, hell then i'll just get my other one from parrot. do you have # or contact person?.

grcplaya

Great info, but I'm a little confused.
Everyone is postivie a 2.5mm will fit, so the mic from the 3200 kit is the one to order...correct?
I can't use an adapter due to the location of where it plugs into the Z1 and a big crosscar beam that give about a 1/4 inch clearance to the back of the plugs.

Directional mics will certainly help, but echo reduction and noise cancellation is done with software...not hardware. Fortunately, it appears that Windows can handle this admirably. Since the Z1 is Windows driven, it seems to me that Pioneer could fix this with a software update. Maybe this should be brought up on that open discussion thing they're having.

03Aviator said:

it seems to me that Pioneer could fix this with a software update. Maybe this should be brought up on that open discussion thing they're having.

That discussion thing was over days ago and trust me... the topic was "touched upon" :)

Well... to prove the point about software vs microphone...

I now have tried 4 microphones....

1. Avic-Z1 supplied one: ECHO
2. Motorola BT kit one: No Echo with Motorola Kit, plenty o' ECHO with Z1
3. Nokia HFM-8 Microphone: ECHO (but nicest looking mic and LITTLE less echo with higher volume)
4. Parrot CK3200 mic: ECHO, ECHO, ECHO!!!!!!

Arghhhhhhh.

BTW, tried multiple locations in the car...always the same...echo does not significantly go away unless the volume is set down to about 3 bars....

Remember: :x in my same car, with the same LG VX9800 phone, i had the Motorola kit before with ZERO echo...

I am a believer.... i believe Pioneer makes a great potential product..... shitty software execution.... It's not like you need to be programming in some esoteric EEPROM language.... it's frikin' Windows.

I hope you guys nailed them good during the online discussion.

Sam

That's disappointing to hear. I just ordered my mic from parrot.

I've got foam around my mic and that helped quite a bit...but didn't cure it. Next, I may try and attach a small piece of plastic as a "deflector" to keep the sound waves from the speaker from having a direct shot at the mic. This should help some too. But the best cure is going to have to come from Pioneer in the form of a software upgrade...and possibly a better mic. I think a directional mic would help some too.

The Nokia and Parrot mics i tried are directional. I also re-aligned the speakers so that the SPL does not directly hit the mic.

Tried the foam approach too.

:cry:

well I getting ready to install my 2nd z1 with the another parrot mic that parrot sent and yes you do need the adapter for it, will see what happens. but on my f150 I have no problems with the parrot mic no echo's, sorry to hear that it didnt work for you.

grcplaya

update well finally got done with the z1 installed in my 03 yukon xl what a nightmare but its done just need to hookup the vss n reverse wire. well parrot sent me a mic and I installed it with no problems or echo's and it did need the adapter. it works flawlessly.

grcplaya

are you talking echo that is heard in the car or by the caller?