4. Overall there are a couple of other improvements in the 130 that while small, make it a lot easier to use. For those of you who own the 120, I would definitely upgrade the software to the 130 when that upgrade is made available. It will be well, well worth it.

 

Cheers

Tamir

when will the upgrade ever happen? i am amazed it is not an open system that would allow a real programmer to make changes to the code. i am still amazed the presets don't automatically put the station number in the line for Sirius. interesting is that a you tube video about the Z120 says it does show it for XM.

I'm curious what the results of new mics were. I have the F700BT and stumbled upon this thread while trying to diagnose my own very similar problem. My mic just stopped inputting one day, literally the day before I had perfect BT calling. I removed the mic and attached it to my computer. I was able to use it through my computer, so the mic is functioning, I just get no input (call or voice command). I can hear the other side of my calls fine. I've deleted my paired devices, re paired, etc several times. I'm to the point now that I'm curious how the mic is wired in to the unit, and if it might be possible that something inside the head unit itself went bad. Any thoughts?

i have called tech support 4 times, i was never given an incident number, and talked to the installer a few times on this issue. the response seems to be to blame the Iphone. but what the Iphone has to do with the slowness of the whole system, the inability of the 120 to understand instructions for the NAV system as well as the phone, the horible voice that is used in the VR system compared to the one used in the NAV instructions. Even if it did understand a simple word like find POI, the delay to react to it is too long. by the time i get it to actually respond to finding a starbucks i have gone 5 miles. when i tested the system in the mazda from the factory it responds fast and clearly.

this is all software! whoever they are using for programing is not someone that understands the needs of the customer. this should be an open system that would allow one of us to program the unit because i know i have people that program our products that could do a better job than the ones pioneer has.

i wanted the mazda stock Nav system but was lied to by the dealer that i could have a better unit from after market. not true if it does not work for the VR which is one feature that is why we want a system like this.

how about a class action law suit to get pioneer moving on a software upgrade?

i have called tech support 4 times, i was never given an incident number, and talked to the installer a few times on this issue. the response seems to be to blame the Iphone. but what the Iphone has to do with the slowness of the whole system, the inability of the 120 to understand instructions for the NAV system as well as the phone, the horible voice that is used in the VR system compared to the one used in the NAV instructions. Even if it did understand a simple word like find POI, the delay to react to it is too long. by the time i get it to actually respond to finding a starbucks i have gone 5 miles. when i tested the system in the mazda from the factory it responds fast and clearly.

 

this is all software! whoever they are using for programing is not someone that understands the needs of the customer. this should be an open system that would allow one of us to program the unit because i know i have people that program our products that could do a better job than the ones pioneer has.

 

i wanted the mazda stock Nav system but was lied to by the dealer that i could have a better unit from after market. not true if it does not work for the VR which is one feature that is why we want a system like this.

 

how about a class action law suit to get pioneer moving on a software upgrade?

If you had read the previous posts, you would realize that this thread has simply documented the fact that BT is very poor for calls.

I highly doubt it is software - because they would have fixed it in the Z120 update. VR does not work for the same reason BT calls does not work - garbage in = garbage out........

If you had read the previous posts, you would realize that this thread has simply documented the fact that BT is very poor for calls.

I highly doubt it is software - because they would have fixed it in the Z120 update. VR does not work for the same reason BT calls does not work - garbage in = garbage out........

what update? and yes it is software, it is that VR engine that starts and that is the software. it is not the mic that is the problem. all the delays and not understanding what is spoken, that is all software. and it can be updated if they want to. but if they have no incentive why do it. the shop can be blamed for continuing to sell the z120 when it seems the 130 does not have the problem. or maybe it does and i am not seeing the comments on it.

but please do not think this is not a software issue.

I'm a software quality assurance specialist and believe me this is software related unless the hardware component(s) responsible for handling the input of the mic are the cause of this bluetooth/VR issue. The fact that some of us including myself have tried other mic’s on the 120 proves the mic is not the issue especially for those of us who used the supplied mic on another unit and saw it work.

The fact that the 130 seems to have these issues resolved indicates the software has been updated to correct previous defects or perhaps a rewriting of the code occurred. Again, this assumes the hardware component(s) that process the input from the mic or take the mic connection are not the cause. But if they are, it would appear the 130 has addressed those as well.

OK so purchasing a new MIC will not solve the crappy quality issue?

i had an interesting discussion with Rocky. here is his comments

1. there are no updates to the Z120 and there never will be any. it is a dead product no longer in production.

2. the Z130 while using a different chip has the same VR issues as the Z120.

3. all products are driven not by American consumers but by the Japan office.

My comments

1. blaming the BT for the VR problems makes no sense since the problem also exist in the navigation system.

2. blaming the Sirius tuner for not having the station information for the presets makes no sense since the station information is on the screen and it is poor programing that cannot take the information and stick it in to the preset. if nothing else why not allow the user to type in the station information into the preset?

3. i also told him that mobile is a town in Alabama and not another work for cel phone. the mis-pronunciation of the word by the VR shows that it is wasting programing space trying to sound out a work rather than recognizing the word when there are only a few choices of types of numbers

4. blaming the IPhone that the contacts are not downloaded to the Z120 but need to use BT to look up contacts when using VR again is poor programing because the phone book should be downloaded to the Z120.

i think at this point pioneer has a problem and really can care less about fixing it. they have no incentive to fix it. people buy the product, it takes weeks to figure out it is not the person but the equipment that is bad and then it is too late to return it.

it really reminds me of the problems i have had with Sony and what they consider warranty issues on their computers. it took my calling the head office to get them to replace parts. but in this case i am not sure what can be done. Rocky said that the problems with VR and BT are there in the Z130 but we are not seeing the discussions because they did not sell that many yet. i think the only answer is to try to get the state to force whomever you bought it from to replace it with a different brand and if enough people do that then maybe pioneer will release an update. but they are so big and have money coming from other product lines, i am not sure they care that much.

i had an interesting discussion with Rocky. here is his comments

1. there are no updates to the Z120 and there never will be any. it is a dead product no longer in production.

2. the Z130 while using a different chip has the same VR issues as the Z120.

3. all products are driven not by American consumers but by the Japan office.

My comments

1. blaming the BT for the VR problems makes no sense since the problem also exist in the navigation system.

2. blaming the Sirius tuner for not having the station information for the presets makes no sense since the station information is on the screen and it is poor programing that cannot take the information and stick it in to the preset. if nothing else why not allow the user to type in the station information into the preset?

3. i also told him that mobile is a town in Alabama and not another work for cel phone. the mis-pronunciation of the word by the VR shows that it is wasting programing space trying to sound out a work rather than recognizing the word when there are only a few choices of types of numbers

4. blaming the IPhone that the contacts are not downloaded to the Z120 but need to use BT to look up contacts when using VR again is poor programing because the phone book should be downloaded to the Z120.

 

i think at this point pioneer has a problem and really can care less about fixing it. they have no incentive to fix it. people buy the product, it takes weeks to figure out it is not the person but the equipment that is bad and then it is too late to return it.

 

it really reminds me of the problems i have had with Sony and what they consider warranty issues on their computers. it took my calling the head office to get them to replace parts. but in this case i am not sure what can be done. Rocky said that the problems with VR and BT are there in the Z130 but we are not seeing the discussions because they did not sell that many yet. i think the only answer is to try to get the state to force whomever you bought it from to replace it with a different brand and if enough people do that then maybe pioneer will release an update. but they are so big and have money coming from other product lines, i am not sure they care that much.

That's disappointing. I got the unit installed yesterday, called my dad on the way home and he couldn't understand a word I was saying.

moving the mic to a dead spot out of the area of air movement from the air con and window i think helps. i also think putting a sock over it helps. but there are upgrades to the BT and i am surprised that they don't even want to use those upgrades.

I think everyone understands that software is a key piece of voice recognition.

If you would read the posts, to me it is very very clear that there is an issue between the mic and its associated decoding (analog circuit - hardware).

If you have a VERY noisy circuit (regardless of where that noise comes from), you would need very good noise cancellation circuitry/SW to clear that up (similar to what the Jawbones of the world do). Taking an analog mic input, and converting it is nothing more than trivial. This is the garbage-in portion of my garbage in = garbage out analogy.

VR is also trivial - you buy a SW module that runs on the WinCE OS. However, if you feed that module a noisy input, the VR software will not perform (hence the garbage out portion of the garbage in = garbage out analogy).

Try driving in a Lexus with the sunroof open, and windows down - make a phone call - the caller will hear noise. Now try using VR in the same system - guess what - it's not going to perform well... Strange things happen when you will a signal with noise.........

As for the Z130 working, unless they changed the analog circuit (via different components, or PCB layout), it likely has the same issue(s)... I haven't seen enough here to show me anything has changed from the Z110/Z120. I'd guess very little has changed - and it would take more than one or two posts to convince me otherwise. You don't think Pioneer posts here too

If you have the time and knowledge, you could trace the schematic - find the analog input to its amplifier - cut traces, hard wire a mic onto the PCB. If you still get noise, you could build your own mic/amp with a nice filter, shielded cable and quality components - then cut out the old, and solder in the new (as close to the ARM input - if indeed that's the chip doing the AD - as possible)...............

Or as I have done, give up using BT for calls, and chalk it up to features that suck (BT calls, VR)...

You won't fix it with a mic or software... And yes they have released at least 3 versions of BT software - if you think there's a bug in the code introducing this background noise, surely that would have been fixed long ago (in Z120 - yes Z120 had like 2 BT updates)...

Soon hopefully the system will open up and at least give us a few things to play with...

i am using the attached mic that came with the unit. or i assume it came with the unit but when you say you gave up BT that means you gave up phone calls because if the phone is connected by BT to the Z120 then you are making calls by BT even if you are using a hard wired mic. correct?

i am using the attached mic that came with the unit. or i assume it came with the unit but when you say you gave up BT that means you gave up phone calls because if the phone is connected by BT to the Z120 then you are making calls by BT even if you are using a hard wired mic. correct?

I do not use the Z120 for BT calls due to the mic quality.

I do not use the Z120 for BT calls due to the mic quality.

but is it the mic or is it the BT? can you plug the iphone in and use it like an ipod and also use it to make calls via the hard cable? i will try to see if that works.

To add salt to the wound.

Pioneer called me today while I was on my way to work. i answered with the bluetooth and she kept saying "hello, are you there?" I had to switch to the phone itself since she couldn't hear me.

To add salt to the wound.

 

Pioneer called me today while I was on my way to work. i answered with the bluetooth and she kept saying "hello, are you there?" I had to switch to the phone itself since she couldn't hear me.

Hi freaksavior,

What did pioneer have to say?

Hi freaksavior,

 

What did pioneer have to say?

It wasn't about the blue tooth, I should have said something but she was only a parts person. I had orderd the firmware update sd card since the whole unit seems to be a failure

It wasn't about the blue tooth, I should have said something but she was only a parts person. I had orderd the firmware update sd card since the whole unit seems to be a failure

Is there a later update from what's reported on the site? I think I'm at 1.02..

but is it the mic or is it the BT? can you plug the iphone in and use it like an ipod and also use it to make calls via the hard cable? i will try to see if that works.

Read the posts - it is the MIC. BT for sound is wonderful. BT for calls sucks because it uses the external MIC. My phone has a feature that allows me to turn off BT for MIC (use the phone's mic) - with this off, the radio still mutes, but the phone is used for the call (via headset) - everything is crystal clear that way...

Read the posts - it is the MIC. BT for sound is wonderful. BT for calls sucks because it uses the external MIC. My phone has a feature that allows me to turn off BT for MIC (use the phone's mic) - with this off, the radio still mutes, but the phone is used for the call (via headset) - everything is crystal clear that way...

This

i guess i am not being clear. the mic is hard wired to the radio system. the system then sends the voice to the phone via BT.

i guess i am not being clear. the mic is hard wired to the radio system. the system then sends the voice to the phone via BT.

All communication via BT is crystal clear... Anything that goes into the "hard wired" external mic is garbage... Where it goes from there is relative. If it's sent to be processed by VR, it goes back to garbage in, garbage out. If it's sent to the BT call portion, it's still garbage in, garbage out - your caller will hear noise... At least it's predictable

i can't seem to make you understand. what communication via bluetooth to the z120? there is none other than it being used as the speaker for the phone and the ipod and retriving the phone book. the mic takes your voice to the BT in the Z120 and sends it to the phone. the phone sends it back and the Z120 sends it to the speakers. if you mean the BT on your phone is sounding good via a different BT head set, then that means the BT on the phone is fine. but it says nothing to the BT in the Z120.

i can't seem to make you understand. what communication via bluetooth to the z120? there is none other than it being used as the speaker for the phone and the ipod and retriving the phone book. the mic takes your voice to the BT in the Z120 and sends it to the phone. the phone sends it back and the Z120 sends it to the speakers. if you mean the BT on your phone is sounding good via a different BT head set, then that means the BT on the phone is fine. but it says nothing to the BT in the Z120.

Ummmmmmmmm my personal phone(s) connects to the Z120 via BT - maybe yours does not....

There is only one way to use BT with the Z120 - you sync your phone/device, then use BT for things like calls or music streaming...

Not sure why this concept is so difficult for you...

Maybe read the manual??? While I personally don't believe in Wikis much, maybe this will help you with the basic concept...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluetooth

Z130 has the crappy mic issue resolved!

I had a Z110 and Z120, both were JUNK on BT phone calls. It's finally fixed on the Z130.