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Upgrading NEX4000 to NEX4100 - Work in Progress

By Covert_Death · Mar 24, 2015in NEX Series💬 624 posts👁️ 179,956 views
Page 8 of 25
Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 00:54 UTC#176

Being the new guy here I'm hoping I can add to this discussion on two fronts, first and most importantly, getting the x100 series firmwares to work in our x000 units, and secondly how pioneer sees the whole support of older head units issue.

 

First,

 

From reading the fail overflow blog I think I have a pretty good idea as to why both he Bluetooth and idatalink issues are happening when a x100 series update is applied to a x000 unit.

 

It seems it may be related to the devices being mounted by the android OS.

 

Failoverflow lists the devices of the x000 firmware as follows.

 

/dev/ttymxc0 — console port (can’t find this electrically)

/dev/ttymxc1 — Bluetooth module, 115200 bps

/dev/ttymxc2 — used to talk to “uComâ€, which is apparently a “System Microcomputer†(?!?)

/dev/ttymxc2 — used for the GPS interface (not clear how this is shared with uCom)

/dev/ttymxc3 — used for RDS / TMC transceiver (not sure how this works)

/dev/ttymxc4 — used to talk to the iDatalink connector on the back of the unit

/dev/ttymxc4 — CAN bus interface (not used on my model)

In theory, if the x100 firmware is using different device names for the ports, then when the OS goes to look for something it can't find it and therefore can't communicate with it.

 

It also follows that the device names might be set in a system area which is not modified by the newer firmware and hence the communication problem.

 

I guess the way to test this theory is to pull a full SD card out of an say an 8100 and put it in an 8000. If everything then works as advertised, then you would simply have to do a "full" update of all partitions to the 8100 firmware and bravo, a 8100 in the body of an 8000.

 

The failoverflow blog gives a ton of insight into the inner workings of the OS in these units. Well, at least it gives enough insight to start looking at reasons why the units might not be fully working on the new firmware. It seems that it's fair to believe that the older x000 hardware should support this newer firmware. Unfortunately I don't have the tools or the time to verify this theory, but I'm throwing it out there in he hopes it might help someone crack this.

 

Now, my second part of this and the catalyst for the first part.

One of my best friends owns a very successful car stereo shop. Over the 20 or so years we have been friends I help him do installs from time to time and often enjoy troubleshooting "interesting" problems with him. I was lucky enough to have him in invite me to a trade show today. While there I got into a rather heated and lengthy discussion with the Pioneer rep in charge of the whole northeast region of the U.S. He wasn't a bad guy but he was definitely a salesman to the core. I beat him up pretty badly for the lack of support for older units and he utter failure of Pioneer with issues such as Avicsync. In the end the two things he said that pissed me off the most were.

"We are in the business of selling radios." Which means to me why update older stuff when we can force you to buy a new unit if you want these features that badly.

"If we build a million radios this year we will sell a million radios this year. Pioneer is car audio." Which translates to... We don't have to put effort into continuously improving our products because we are banking on the fact that we can sell half assed products which are still better than our competitors.

 

Unfortunately he's sort of right. He pissed me off so much I was ready to rip out my NEX-8000 and buy the top of the line Kenwood with CarPlay. Problem there is that the Kenwood with CarPlay isn't even released yet and it is still lacking compared to the NEX-8000 from last year. So Pioneer knows exactly what they are doing, much to the dismay of all the tech geeks like myself. Personally, I think the best way to fight back is to get a perfectly working x100 firmware for the x000 series receivers and show the world how full of crap Pioneer is about these "hardware" differences. Sorry for the long post. Just my $.02.

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 01:06 UTC#177

Thanks Rooster,

 

both very insightful thoughts!

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 03:28 UTC#178

Being the new guy here I'm hoping I can add to this discussion on two fronts, first and most importantly, getting the x100 series firmwares to work in our x000 units, and secondly how pioneer sees the whole support of older head units issue.

 

First,

 

From reading the fail overflow blog I think I have a pretty good idea as to why both he Bluetooth and idatalink issues are happening when a x100 series update is applied to a x000 unit.

 

It seems it may be related to the devices being mounted by the android OS.

 

Failoverflow lists the devices of the x000 firmware as follows.

 

/dev/ttymxc0 — console port (can’t find this electrically)

/dev/ttymxc1 — Bluetooth module, 115200 bps

/dev/ttymxc2 — used to talk to “uComâ€, which is apparently a “System Microcomputer†(?!?)

/dev/ttymxc2 — used for the GPS interface (not clear how this is shared with uCom)

/dev/ttymxc3 — used for RDS / TMC transceiver (not sure how this works)

/dev/ttymxc4 — used to talk to the iDatalink connector on the back of the unit

/dev/ttymxc4 — CAN bus interface (not used on my model)

In theory, if the x100 firmware is using different device names for the ports, then when the OS goes to look for something it can't find it and therefore can't communicate with it.

 

It also follows that the device names might be set in a system area which is not modified by the newer firmware and hence the communication problem.

 

I guess the way to test this theory is to pull a full SD card out of an say an 8100 and put it in an 8000. If everything then works as advertised, then you would simply have to do a "full" update of all partitions to the 8100 firmware and bravo, a 8100 in the body of an 8000.

 

The failoverflow blog gives a ton of insight into the inner workings of the OS in these units. Well, at least it gives enough insight to start looking at reasons why the units might not be fully working on the new firmware. It seems that it's fair to believe that the older x000 hardware should support this newer firmware. Unfortunately I don't have the tools or the time to verify this theory, but I'm throwing it out there in he hopes it might help someone crack this.

 

Now, my second part of this and the catalyst for the first part.

One of my best friends owns a very successful car stereo shop. Over the 20 or so years we have been friends I help him do installs from time to time and often enjoy troubleshooting "interesting" problems with him. I was lucky enough to have him in invite me to a trade show today. While there I got into a rather heated and lengthy discussion with the Pioneer rep in charge of the whole northeast region of the U.S. He wasn't a bad guy but he was definitely a salesman to the core. I beat him up pretty badly for the lack of support for older units and he utter failure of Pioneer with issues such as Avicsync. In the end the two things he said that pissed me off the most were.

"We are in the business of selling radios." Which means to me why update older stuff when we can force you to buy a new unit if you want these features that badly.

"If we build a million radios this year we will sell a million radios this year. Pioneer is car audio." Which translates to... We don't have to put effort into continuously improving our products because we are banking on the fact that we can sell half assed products which are still better than our competitors.

 

Unfortunately he's sort of right. He pissed me off so much I was ready to rip out my NEX-8000 and buy the top of the line Kenwood with CarPlay. Problem there is that the Kenwood with CarPlay isn't even released yet and it is still lacking compared to the NEX-8000 from last year. So Pioneer knows exactly what they are doing, much to the dismay of all the tech geeks like myself. Personally, I think the best way to fight back is to get a perfectly working x100 firmware for the x000 series receivers and show the world how full of crap Pioneer is about these "hardware" differences. Sorry for the long post. Just my $.02.

 

I went to my local car audio shop the other day and asked the guy which company makes the best displays. He told me none of them because they all buy the same crap and it all sucks. Speaks volumes to the car audio industry. 

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 14:16 UTC#179

I say lets get together and donate to Cover_Death to buy the new 4100 and a 4000. Then lets put our thinking caps on and lets get this thing working.  

 

Lets do it to show everyone that Pioneer is full of BS (when it comes to Android Auto will not work on the old 4000 units)

 

TheRooster has a valid point in his first statement, thanks for pointing that out.

 

 

any thoughts?

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 14:23 UTC#180

Just a quick update.  

I had a little free time and decided to play with the update process.

Same results as everyone here regarding the bluetooth issue.

What is a bigger concern to me is the Navigation portion having a whitewashed screen with the 1.03 X100 update applied. I'm not sure if this is a map issue.

 

I think the key here is to extract the internal SD card from an X100 series model and try it in corresponding X000 series model. That way we know if it is a firmware issue or if Pioneer has somehow intentionally "tweaked" the new models to purposely break an attempt at updates.

This is a very worthwhile project, I just hope we can get enough collaboration to make it a go.

Again, I think the failoverflow blog is an invaluable resource to help us along this journey.

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 15:22 UTC#181

Has anyone considered trying to get someone from the XDA Developers forums involved with this? There's a huge amount of Android hacking talent there, since these radios ARE Android devices maybe someone there could figure this out... Just a thought.

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 15:26 UTC#182

Has anyone considered trying to get someone from the XDA Developers forums involved with this? There's a huge amount of Android hacking talent there, since these radios ARE Android devices maybe someone there could figure this out... Just a thought.

 

That's a great idea. I frequent those forums, but don't post, nor do I have any ties to them. Does anyone here have a better connection?

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 17:23 UTC#183

I believe that there was some work over there regarding the AppRadio2 and it's android OS. Quite honestly if they took a look at this I tend to believe they would come up with a solution. Many times it's not about the talent, but rather the tools. Seeing what the problem is becomes more than half way to solving it.

 

On another note, I tried to update my NEX-8000 to the 3.41 Bluetooth with no luck... Forgive my laziness, but can someone post a step by step on getting the updated Bluetooth firmware into a NEX running 1.08. Thanks.

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 18:27 UTC#184

 

 

On another note, I tried to update my NEX-8000 to the 3.41 Bluetooth with no luck... Forgive my laziness, but can someone post a step by step on getting the updated Bluetooth firmware into a NEX running 1.08. Thanks.

 

Download the firmware on page 1 of this thread for the 8000 (1.08) to 8100 (1.03) firmware onto a USB flash drive.  USB drive formatted to FAT 32 and make sure it's empty.

Turn off BT on your phone.

Disconnect any USB/AUX/HDMI connections.

Turn your 8000 on.

Turn off the display.

Press the gears in upper right corner.

Press the BT icon on bottom left.

Scroll down to BT Software Update.

Insert USB flash drive into USB 1.

Press start and wait.  

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 19:18 UTC#185

Just a quick update.  

I had a little free time and decided to play with the update process.

Same results as everyone here regarding the bluetooth issue.

What is a bigger concern to me is the Navigation portion having a whitewashed screen with the 1.03 X100 update applied. I'm not sure if this is a map issue.

 

I think the key here is to extract the internal SD card from an X100 series model and try it in corresponding X000 series model. That way we know if it is a firmware issue or if Pioneer has somehow intentionally "tweaked" the new models to purposely break an attempt at updates.

This is a very worthwhile project, I just hope we can get enough collaboration to make it a go.

Again, I think the failoverflow blog is an invaluable resource to help us along this journey.

 

 

In regards to the X000 map issue, since the 1.03 firmware changes both the device and navigation numbers, I suspect we'll need to update to the X100 maps.

 

Unfortunately, Naviextras doesn't have the X100 units listed yet so we can see what happens when trying to update.

Posted Apr 03, 2015 · 20:32 UTC#186

In regards to the X000 map issue, since the 1.03 firmware changes both the device and navigation numbers, I suspect we'll need to update to the X100 maps.

 

Unfortunately, Naviextras doesn't have the X100 units listed yet so we can see what happens when trying to update.

That seems like the most plausible explanation which makes a complete image of the x100 internal SD card that much more important.

 

I just find it a little strange that the "structure" of a map file can change that much. I wonder if they are somehow keyed to a device number or software version to prevent "cross usage" almost like a lock to a particular range of devices or even a specific device. I mean after all, if you attempt a map upgrade it asks you to insert the USB stick so the unit can "prepare" it for an upgrade. Just really thinking out loud here no real evidence to support any thing.

Posted Apr 04, 2015 · 16:36 UTC#187

I have a 6000nex and my GPS works perfectly, but I can't figure out how to access android auto.

Posted Apr 04, 2015 · 19:39 UTC#188

I don't believe the 5000 and 6000 units received android auto in the refresh, only the 4000, 7000, and 8000.

Posted Apr 05, 2015 · 17:04 UTC#189

Hoping to get clarification here: is there an image for the 5000 to 5100, or am I hosed?

Posted Apr 05, 2015 · 21:04 UTC#190

I am guessing that since the 5100 has it disabled, the work around upgrade being tried here will also be disabled on the 5000.

Posted Apr 05, 2015 · 21:06 UTC#191

Can anyone confirm that the NEX BYPASS (by tapping the screen in the special spot stickied in the forum) works after upgrading to the 1.03 x100 firmware?

Posted Apr 05, 2015 · 22:46 UTC#192

Can anyone confirm that the NEX BYPASS (by tapping the screen in the special spot stickied in the forum) works after upgrading to the 1.03 x100 firmware?

 

NEX BYPASS worked fine with my 7000 & 1.03.  I didn't have to reset it either. 

Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 05:01 UTC#193

I don't believe the 5000 and 6000 units received android auto in the refresh, only the 4000, 7000, and 8000.

I dont think I've ever had more regret in a purchase than in buying this head unit.

Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 12:29 UTC#194

I dont think I've ever had more regret in a purchase than in buying this head unit.

Couldn't agree more.  I was very excited for the promise of CarPlay, and in the end the only feature that I actually use that wasn't in my factory radio is the HD Radio.  I don't use CarPlay anymore in the least bit.  It was a colossal disappointment.  Never again, Pioneer.

Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 13:59 UTC#195

Couldn't agree more. I was very excited for the promise of CarPlay, and in the end the only feature that I actually use that wasn't in my factory radio is the HD Radio. I don't use CarPlay anymore in the least bit. It was a colossal disappointment. Never again, Pioneer.

CarPlay sucking isn't exactly Pioneer's fault.

Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 14:16 UTC#196

CarPlay sucking isn't exactly Pioneer's fault.

No, but the lack of support for future updates, spotty Bluetooth, poor system UI, etc certainly are.

Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 15:12 UTC#197

No, but the lack of support for future updates, spotty Bluetooth, poor system UI, etc certainly are.

 

My thoughts exactly. I will never buy a Pioneer product again (been doing that with Sony for over 10 years now). Vote with your wallet!

Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 16:23 UTC#198

My thoughts exactly. I will never buy a Pioneer product again (been doing that with Sony for over 10 years now). Vote with your wallet!

extremely happy with my 8000, screen is beautiful...bluetooth works as it should...no complaints

Edited Apr 06, 2015 by onebyside
Posted Apr 06, 2015 · 18:16 UTC#199

extremely happy with my 8000, screen is beautiful...bluetooth works as it should...no complaints

same here I had 8000nex and the bluetooth worked fine for me, I upgraded(or down graded ) to the 4100nex  for android Auto and everything seems to work great, only complaint i have is that damn Nag screen every-time I start my truck :eek:

Posted Apr 07, 2015 · 02:23 UTC#200

Hey guys new to the forums! I had a thought cuz the screen is different on the 4000 - 4100 has anyone tired to take one from the 4100 and put it on 4000 with the firmware update? Anyone have access to this? Sorry if this has been mentioned before but I did read this whole thread.

 

Btw here is the screen from Pioneer http://parts.pioneerelectronics.com/part.asp?productNum=CXE7770....?

 

Also if anyone has had any success with hooking up the 4000 to a rooted note 3 and used it with google chromecast without it being extremely zoomed in the top left of the phone mirroring I would appreciate the advice! Thanks

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