OSUV Posted January 3, 2007 Report Share Posted January 3, 2007 Actually, you may be right or wrong tillithz. Only time will tell. As of right now, there are probably 50 or more new Z1's being sold every month on eBay which tells me that there is a current surplus. Once the Z2's are released, I will keep an eye on eBay to see if the prices do noticably drop. By the way, what does tillithz mean? Just curious. And Rodge, I certanily appreciate and understand your skepticism with refurbees, especially when you have had the unfortune of selling items that die out prematurely. However, I see the reliability issues of powertools as being totally different than those of electronics, primarily due to the constant movement of the power tool and the uncertainty of how it is being used by the end consumer. I have always had great experiences with my purchases of refurbished electronics in the past (knock on plastic). In fact, I have never even had to utilize the warranty on any of the refurbed items I have purchased in the past. Maybe I'm just lucky, but again, refurbed items do have the advantage of having been re-inspected and sometimes even upgraded and/or updated. So I am sold on refurbees and will ALWAYS buy them first whenever they're available. But I do highly recommend extending a warranty of any expensive electronic product (new or refurbished) whenever it comes with less than a 1 year factory warranty. I love this site by the way. Lots of great information. Kevin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillithz Posted January 3, 2007 Report Share Posted January 3, 2007 right on for your investigation, but hardly believe that 50+ units sold a month, which really isnt many. You can call many retailers, online or physical addressed stores, and find that they are out of stock. Even LEGIT distributors that are authorized by pioneer are out. So honestly, its a no brainer, as they continue to sell 50+ units on ebay, they will be further less available. till it hz the circuit city old timers will know what that is. Congrats on your refurb experience. Keep in mind that many ebay sellers, and even shady sites sell the z1 as new but its refurbished and even sometimes doesnt even come complete, and when you buy the other stuff it was missing are right up there if not more expensive then just buying new. Also, keep in mind that a refurb will never be better as far as parts and upgraded things within it, it can only be AS GOOD but never better. Also, with a refurb, you have to accept the blemishes that come with a used item, scratches as minor as they may be are still something that has to be accepted. Personally I love opening NEW electronics and the smell and perfection that comes with it is great in compared to someone who used it at a previous time. Things that you are willing to let be with a used item, is probably something I wouldnt, maybe I'm just a perfectionist. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
OSUV Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 tillithz, Your skepticism is well taken. I have been buying and selling on eBay for nearly 10 years now and fortunately, I have become pretty saavy in knowing who to trust and who not to trust. Feedback helps paint a picture about the seller, however, further investigation about the seller is still duly warranted. I can appreciate the fact that you enjoy sniffing new plastic and embrace the "perception" of perfection. I for one woud rather sniff a good buy and there is no such thing as perfection. Just read this forum! I don't understand why everyone assumes that refurbished items always have blemishes or scratches. Generally, whenever a cosmetic-type component, on a product that is being refurbed, is scratched or marred in any way, the factory that is reconditioning the product, in this case Pioneer, will replace that part with a brand new one. The returned product may have just had a burned out flourescent bulb or maybe an internal circuit that went bad. Don't assume that refurbished means products of abuse. Especially when it comes to electronics. More times than not, they are not abused, for the mere fact that abused products are usually rejected by the manufacturer who thus voids warranty coverage. Many times these refurbished products are gone through more rigorous testing then when they were new. I don't think that Pioneer wants to see their refurbished products back on their test bench within that 90 day warranty period. Instead they've most likely isolated the problem and repaired it with the goal of preventing it from recurring in the future. To use a good analogy of buying New vs. Refurbished or Used, when shopping for a car, you can decide to buy a brand new one and wind up owning either an excellent vehicle with no problems whatsoever or getting stuck with a lemon. Either way, you paid a premium for that car because it was new. Or instead, you can buy a certified preowned vehicle with 10,000 miles on it and opt for an extended warranty and wind up owning a great "like new" vehicle with no problems whatsoever or get a heap of metal that is nothing but a daily headache that you can't seem to cure. However, by buying the used car, you just saved yourself a bunch of money and still got the same protection (and many times longer protection w/ the extended warranty) as you would have by buying the new one. And now you have $5000-$10,000 more to put towards your teenager's college fund. Either way, you've assumed a risk when buying the new or the used car. Getting back to the AVIC, keep in mind that once you've installed it in your car, it is no longer new. It is now USED isn't it? If you pulled it out the next day and tried to re-sell it, how much do you think you could get for it? Could you offer your perspective buyer an extended warranty? Look, we can debate this topic forever. The point is that there is ALWAYS an assumed risk when buying ANYTHING; refurbished, used or new. But by extending the warranty coverage, the risk becomes minimal. You may continue perusing your dashboard with your nose hoping to get just one more sniff of that lovely perfume called "Plastic Pioneer Paradise" but a year down the road, when your AVIC-Z1 (The artist formerly known as New) dies, you will be the one bearing the repair costs while I kick back sipping margaritas continuing to enjoy peace of mind for another 455 days. And I'll bet that I paid less than what you did for your Z1, including my extended warranty cost. I'll also bet that after that year is up, my AVIC Z1 will smell just as good as yours. Be cool tillithz! You are my friend! Cheers! Kevin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillithz Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 lol, your funny and make some sense, cept the car analogy doesnt really work cuz IF it was abused, the warranty doesnt cover that, I dont know of ANY warranty for a car that covers abuse like burnouts and dropping it into reverse at 70 mph. So a new car is much less likely to have that abuse and hence be covered by the standard warranty. Thats why I buy new cars, not used, unless I know the history of the car, thats why carfax and other services are so big, people want to know for a reason. You know the type of things people say they do to rentals. but besides the point, in the end, my cars, and equipment smells great a year down the road, I take care of my stuff, that is why I get top dollar for stuff if i sell it. My last vehicle I sold for the same price I paid for it brand new! 05 subaru sti, figure that one out. and the guy bought a d2 to put in, and has had no problems. Anyone who buys new will surely attest about how they enjoy the security that it has. my perfection is mine. I didnt say all refurbs are due to abuse, and its hard to tell which are and arent thats a crap shoot at best. And a manufacture doesnt care about abuse IF the person fixing it is paying. Pioneer sure as hell will fix abuse if paid, and then the person who sent it in can then say refurbished, and have pioneers warranty on their work that was paid. all in all good that your refurbs have great experience, but when I pay 1500 for something I want the best, and best is new, not fixed to be new, cuz new implies that its never been broke. anyways enjoy your refurbs cuz I will enjoy my news Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fanatik Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 ok back to sites with great prices im ready to buy mine Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillithz Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 theres already a thread here fanatik, just search, theres even info within the thread about sites reliability and pricing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
OSUV Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 digitalfotoclub.com has it for $1547.00 with free shipping. They also have a good customer satisfaction rating. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rodge Posted January 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2007 HaHaHa... OSUV and Tillithz! you guys went FAAAAAR with this one! I'm with Tillithz on the refurb VS. new debate.... OSUV- GOOD POINTS THOUGH MAN, I respect your position.... I would have jumped in this conversation a bit earlier but I was busy selling "RE-FURBS ON E-BAY!!!!!!!" hahahahaha OSUV, obviously electronics and power tools will have different re-furb tendencies, but the point being that a refurb couldn't be any better than a new tool, BUT a new tool could be BETTER than a refurb. So If it's a matter of saving $100 or so, I'd shift my weight to the untouched, un opened, factory sealed unit.... So anyway, back the original post topic, where is the cheapest place to buy a "NEW" Z1 with warranty? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rodge Posted January 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2007 http://www.wisetronics.com/product-p/pi ... lick=15840 $1,559? Decent reviews, anyone know anything about them? OR http://www.pricesrite.com/item.aspx?eid=6&pid=99050 $1,599 looks good to me...... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillithz Posted January 5, 2007 Report Share Posted January 5, 2007 http://www.resellerratings.com/store/Wisetronics and http://www.resellerratings.com/store/Pricesrite doesnt look like it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rodge Posted January 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2007 Again, Tillithz, you are the man...... thanks,again for being right and providing solid info.... at least this thread is going to work and people are seeing all the bad sources on who NOT to buy from! thanks again dude, I'll PM you later Quote Link to post Share on other sites
99Lim Posted January 6, 2007 Report Share Posted January 6, 2007 Now is this a scam or what... looked on ebay and seller has like 8 of these and have like 17 hrs left. Almost perfect feedback and no one has bid on them. http://cgi.ebay.com/PIONEER-AVIC-Z1-NAV ... dZViewItem Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cntrylvr79 Posted January 7, 2007 Report Share Posted January 7, 2007 I'm going to have to go with it's a scam, says invalid item or it was removed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillithz Posted January 7, 2007 Report Share Posted January 7, 2007 it seems reinventing the wheel is popular Quote Link to post Share on other sites
OSUV Posted January 7, 2007 Report Share Posted January 7, 2007 You will see these auctions pop up on ebay every week. They are usually 1 Day auctions and eBay cancels the auctions as soon as they find out that someones account has been hijacked. Most people have caught on and don't even bother to bid on these items. A hijacked account is when someone hacks into another eBayer's account for the sole purpose of utilizing their positive feedback ratiing. If you read the auction description carefully, many times you'll see "Do not bid on this auction until you email me first or your bid will be cancelled" -or- "Don't use eBay to contact me, contact me at this email address". If someone does try to contact the alleged seller through eBay, then the real owner of that account will get the email and not know what the heck is going on. Then the account owner then notifies eBay and the auction is cancelled. And then the following week, that same scumbag, along with many other scumbags will hijack someone else's account and try it again until they hit a sucker that is willing to pay for the item outside of eBay. This has happened to my account a couple of times. NEVER CONTACT A SELLER USING AN EMAIL ADDRESS THAT IS LISTED IN THE AUCTION. ALWAYS CONTACT THE SELLER THROUGH EBAY! Some other good bits of advice are: 1. In addition to reviewing the seller's feedback, look at the sellers previous auctions. If this seller has sold a lot of mobile electronic items in the recent past, chances are better that he is legit. If he mostly sold china dishers or care bears, then the account HAS been hijacked. 2. Look to see how long it has been since the seller has sold an item prior to this current auction. If it has been more than 6 months or if this person has no record of ever selling anything on eBay, be skeptical! 3. If you are skeptical, always contact the seller in advance before bidding and see if they respond. 4. Finally, NEVER EVER WIRE MONEY! Try to encourage the buyer to accept credit card or PayPal payments. You will have some protection with these two payment methods. I hope this input helps. Cheers, Kevin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.