It's because the Z3 is NOT a new unit, It's basically a Z1/Z2 with updated maps and firmware and the like. It's in desperate need up a remodel/makeover. The F series has a higher resolution and better user interface because it's a brand new unit, where as the Z series has had the exact same design since the first Z1 came out, like 3 (or 4?) years ago. Whenever Pioneer decides to re-do (or replace) the Z series, it will most likely have an edge in design over the F-series just as the F-series has an edge in design over it now.

I totally agree with what you're saying and it further validates the point I was trying to make to the Pioneer rep. If the Z-series is supposed to be their flagship unit and the F-series is supposed to be the economy unit, why is the Z-series not superior in all cases? Why did they make minor adjustments to the Z3 compared to the Z2? Couldn't they have put the newer user interface on the Z3?

Regardless, I'm returning mine and getting either the 6620 or the 8120.

an OK interface isnt the only inferior aspect compared to the F. the F has a much better bluetooth setup that actually works, ipod voice command, usb and sd, etc etc, but thats besides the point.

the z3 came out before the F, so they probably didnt really have a need yet to butter up the interface. and with good reason, its only competitor thatd stand a chance against it would be the 8120, and the kenwood doesnt have that great of a resolution either. i think the F's screen are arguably the prettiest and sleekest amongst the double din screens.

but without a doubt the z4 (assuming they dont discontinue the Z like they did the D) will be new and improved, with all the 90bt's features that the z doesnt currently have

just got news that the update for the f series part 2 is soon to come. he said we should be receiving this in about 2 weeks and they will send a email to notify the customers but we all know how slow pioneer is.

a part 2? any word on what it'll fix this time??

a part 2? any word on what it'll fix this time??

the guy said the bluetooth issue the nav issue and mainly the rest of the unresolved.

really? i thought the bluetooth was already fixed...atleast it was for me, and ive read it works now for other members too. whats wrong with the nav, other than the crappy routing and no north heading in 2d?

just got news that the update for the f series part 2 is soon to come. he said we should be receiving this in about 2 weeks and they will send a email to notify the customers but we all know how slow pioneer is.

fingers crossed.

really? i thought the bluetooth was already fixed...atleast it was for me, and ive read it works now for other members too. whats wrong with the nav, other than the crappy routing and no north heading in 2d?

It works better, but this morning after making a call, it took over 55 seconds to hang up. I pressed and pressed and nothing. No music or anything.

really? i thought the bluetooth was already fixed...atleast it was for me, and ive read it works now for other members too. whats wrong with the nav, other than the crappy routing and no north heading in 2d?

he said the connecting/disconnecting off the bluetooth and the nav boxes on the map screen and other little details

1. IPOD disconnects each time the unit starts. I've found that the unit will disconnect the ipod if it boots up with the Navigation screen enabled, (i.e. gives the error "ipod communication error" if you had the navigation screen on before you turned off your car). Switch the screen to ipod before you turn off your car, and the ipod won't disconnect/error next time the unit starts. Can someone verify if this is the case for you as well?

2. Map stays in night mode (the black map) when set to automatic, even though the lights are not on. Turning on the car lights will dim the screen, though, so I know I have it hooked up correctly. I hope that's not the way it's supposed to work. That kinda defeats the purpose of "Automatic".

3. It froze on me when I tried to make a call using the contacts screen.

On the bright side.. I can see the screen and the touch screen works faster.... //trying to be an optimist.

Here is a list of problems that I have seen so far:

1. Bluetooth locked radio up, and lost functionality and sound.

2. Navigation still doesn't tell you right or left side of street.

3. When bluetooth locked radio up in middle of routing me to Circuit City I had to change course becasue the exit it wanted me to take was closed due to construction, well the navigation took me in a big circle just to try to take the same exit! (for you programers out there a big recursive circle) Even after I decided to use my own directions just to see what the unit would do, when I was in front of the store, it wanted me to get back on the highway and go in a big circle, to try to take that exit that was closed for construction. Although I think this might be a result of the bluetooth locking up the navigation. I did a route back to my house and changed course several times just to see how the unit would react and it appeared to adapt to the changes pretty well.

4. Voice regonition for Ipod works good if you are asking for artist but if you ask for album it got it wrong 4 out 4 times. 100% failure.

5. Still gives you too many directions for my taste, very annoying.

6. Contacts are confusing especially if you have multiple numbers for one person.

Here is the good news:

1. The 1,2 miles thing is fixed.

2. Buttons are alot more responsive now once the system is fully loaded.

3. Screen is just as bright now on 4 as it was set on 10 with old firmware

* I flashed at night so didn't test screen readability in sunlight

4. Songs on Ipod play in correct order now, not alphabetical order.

5. Bluetooth when it works is clearer, though I didn't have trouble with it before.

Things I can't confirm or deny

1. Sounds the same as before, as far as I can tell which is good. I did have to set all my sound setting again.

2. Load time (seems to be the same if not a little faster) never timed it before to test.

3. readability in direct sunlight, did update at night and I will have to tell you in about 8 hours or so.

4. Wrong time thing, sometimes my time would be off an hour or two before but it has been right on now, but I would like to have more time to test this before I would say that it is fixed.

5. SD played fine but again I would like to have more time with it before I would say that this was fixed. It did pause fore like a 1/10 of a second while i was changing the splash screen, but I would think this is normal right?

6. Seemed like the VR catalog process was a lot faster this time then before, but again I didn't really use it before because it didn't work, and now it works a little (from what I can tell 50%)

7. Didn't check the MSN direct yet

8. Some people have reported that the navigation voice is set to max when you play music from SD, but I checked my settings and it didn't change for me, although I kept my volume at default, which is not max volume, but rather it looked like 60% which is perfect.

Overall impressions:

I am pleased with this first update and makes me optimistic that Pioneer is able to fix most of the bugs in the unit, I think with just the touch response alone it makes the unit bareable now, and with the Ipod playing songs in right order that was big too, if they can just fix the navigation to tell you what side of the street the destination is on I would be satisfied with the unit. I will update you guys as I find out more information I hope this helps.

2. Map stays in night mode (the black map) when set to automatic, even though the lights are not on. Turning on the car lights will dim the screen, though, so I know I have it hooked up correctly. I hope that's not the way it's supposed to work. That kinda defeats the purpose of "Automatic".

That is because the unit uses the time of day to switch between the day and night displays, not the illumination switch.

Also, the bold/huge type is kind of unnecessary... most of us can keep our type at a normal size and nobody complains that they can't read it. Thanks.

really? i thought the bluetooth was already fixed...atleast it was for me, and ive read it works now for other members too. whats wrong with the nav, other than the crappy routing and no north heading in 2d?

 

he said the connecting/disconnecting off the bluetooth and the nav boxes on the map screen and other little details

I sincerely hope update 2.0 fixes the remaining Bluetooth problems. I'm using a Motorola Q9C, I get no incoming call screen; system hangs up after I end a call and I have to manually disconnect the phone to get music back; and after I finally loaded the contacts (manually, one-by-one) there's no way to differentiate between numbers (e.g.; cell or home) for the same contact. Plus, it switched some of the numbers and is displaying them under the wrong contact. My F90BT came from al-eds with the update already installed, so I didn't see the screen before - but it's still not very bright in the daytime when compared with my D3 in another vehicle. And, I'd like there to be a screen where I can verify the reverse and VSS wires are connected properly. On the positive side, at least Pioneer didn't screw up XM on the F90 - it's functioning just fine.

I think every thread about the blue boxes in the nav window has said that they still appear or now appear in more places after the firmware update. What I want to know is:

1. whether or not anyone's have gone away?

2. Anyone have one of the new systems with the update already installed? do they appear on those units?

Thanks.

I think every thread about the blue boxes in the nav window has said that they still appear or now appear in more places after the firmware update. What I want to know is:

1. whether or not anyone's have gone away?

2. Anyone have one of the new systems with the update already installed? do they appear on those units?

Thanks.

Everyone has them, pre and post update, all in the same place.

A few more things since I have had some good time to work with the unit.

1. While watching a movie on the SD the system will switch to NAV during an incoming telephone call.

2. Bluetooth doesn't mute the audio when a telephone call is established about 25 percent of the time.

3. Ipod is constantly failing on the VR Catalog. Disconnecting works maybe half the time.

Update 1.0 was good, just need to finish the product! Since I have been messing with DIVX files and such this week it is clear the head unit does not have the horsepower to switch between very many things. Sometimes it takes a few minutes unit I can switch back to the SD once it switches to NAV (from an incoming phone call).

Thanks for the update HiFiSi.

My new F700BT unit should be coming within the next week. I wonder if it will have the firmware update already installed (doubt it!). I got a great deal on it through 6th Ave Electronics (authorized dealer) via Amazon. Only 600 bucks shipped! I couldn't believe it.

I had the factory Bose system installed in my car before, so hopefully the install isn't too tricky. I bought the Amp-Integration kit from Crutchfield to avoid that annoying over amplification of the sound problem my past Nissans have had.

1. While watching a movie on the SD the system will switch to NAV during an incoming telephone call.

It seems to do that with everything. not just the SD card. I've had it do that while using ipod and the DVD drive as well.

2. Bluetooth doesn't mute the audio when a telephone call is established about 25 percent of the time.

Never had this one happen yet, even before the firmware update.

3. Ipod is constantly failing on the VR Catalog. Disconnecting works maybe half the time.

Only had the VR catalog update fail once... but the good thing is that once it actually updates the VR catalog, you can turn off the VR updating since it only has to do it that one time. That is until you add or remove something from the ipod, anyway.

1. While watching a movie on the SD the system will switch to NAV during an incoming telephone call.

 

It seems to do that with everything. not just the SD card. I've had it do that while using ipod and the DVD drive as well.

My guess is that the programmers at Pioneer couldn't/wouldn't program the little call status bar so that pops up to overlay on what ever screen your on. Instead they programed it so it would only overlay on the nav screen and if your doing something else then it just brings you over to that screen. Just more evidence this was hugely rushed to market.

Other issues I've had not yet mentioned:

Sometimes the little call status bar doesn't come up at all and I'm fumbling to grab the phone to hang up a call. Seems like it only does this on the first call I make when unit just started up, after that its fine.

F900 ignores preset up/down codes from PAC SWI-PS, this is one of my most frustrating issues.

I've just installed the unit so I haven't played with it to much but so far some of the navigation has been driving me crazy. It keeps trying to put me on side roads and taking me on illogical routes, even when on fastest mode. For example, coming up to my house the street makes a big loop, you can either continue straight and go all the way around the loop to get to my hosue. Or you turn left where the other end of the loop meets the road and which my house is right there. The nav always is telling me to go all the way around the loop.

Also I have basically just turned off Samantha, so robotic sounding and the commands make no sense. I cant find any logic to when she says street names and when she doesn't. Also I hate when I'm on the freeway she basically reads me the name of every exit on the freeway instructing me to keep left. The guy doesn't seem to do that except where it makes sense. I also agree as mentioned earlier that there are just one to many notices for a turn.

Meanwhile my Garmin 760 gives great routes most of the time and sounds natural and great, I even have the choice of 6 different english tts voices. Now I understand that Pioneer did not write the nav code so my compliant here goes to mio.

Another grievance I have is no way to set a max on volume. I always get blasted every time I turn on the car.

On the positive side I am very impressed with the sound quality and being in the audio video industry truly appreciate the powerful eq that is included. I also noted that I have been able to play DVD audio disks in the drive which sounds amazing.

I find it funny btw how people keep complaining about Pioneer's QC, isn't it clear by now that they simply do not have a QC department. I mean how could one comma two miles get through any form of QC.

When I saw the press release on this unit I said finally someone is coming out with an aftermarket nav to set the market on fire. Something that is so much better then everything else on the market that it pushes the market to better itself. Its truly sad to see Pioneer drop the ball like this. However I do believe that Pioneer wants to right their wrongs with this unit so I have confidence they have learned from their mistakes and will make things right.

Does anyone else have the issue where the route information, distance, time etc is a white text on a very light backround?

I mean I get two inches away and its still hard to read, the only alternative is to bring up that route information full screen.

Is there any way to change the text or back round color of the boxes?

I mean this thing makes you think your blind, but yet I can see and read clarly the text and map every where else.

Hopefully this is fixed in the next update, lets pray there is one because if they can just tweak the rest of these little issues, I think I will be very happy.

So I realize that some of these might be wiring issues, but I still doubt it. I'll get around to double checking this weekend.

1) Video playback from my mp3 player (that worked flawlessly on the AVIC-N2) pops up the video in a messy, skewed, badly colored way. Kind of like if you take a picture of a tv when you tried to watch pay per view without paying for it.....Oh, and no audio from it either. Did I have three connections come loose all at once? Doubtful.....

2) Touch screen buttons are slow to operate if at all. Sometimes the touchscreen becomes non-responsive. I have to hit a hardware button, then navigate back to the screen I was using to get the touch screen to work at all.

3) Nav location jumps big time. Despite claiming a strong signal off of 7 satellites, it was jumping from the road I was on, to the next road over, and had me at an altitude of 1500ft when I was actually at about 30'MSL, 6 miles from the beach in S Florida.

4) Of course the boot up speed is pretty nasty, but I can live with it. Until the unit randomly re-booted mid-drive the other day. Again, this could be a lose power wire, but I took my time wiring as much as possible outside the truck first so I'm doubtful that this is it.

I still haven't tried other features yet (bluetooth calling, MSN Direct isn't linking for some reason, video in is still snafu'd, still have to install rear view camera) but so far, I miss the N2 that I had what...four years ago? Was technology really that much better back then in a smaller unit than it is now?

So I realize that some of these might be wiring issues, but I still doubt it. I'll get around to double checking this weekend.

 

1) Video playback from my mp3 player (that worked flawlessly on the AVIC-N2) pops up the video in a messy, skewed, badly colored way. Kind of like if you take a picture of a tv when you tried to watch pay per view without paying for it.....Oh, and no audio from it either. Did I have three connections come loose all at once? Doubtful.....

 

I had a AVIC Z2 that had the same issue with the video. But in my case I had sound. On my Z2 it turned out to be a bad connector on the unit itself and we had to replace the whole unit. It did not happen all the time though. When it happened, I was able to fix it (sort of) by unplugging the mp3 player from the connector and plugging it in again over and over again. Eventually it would start working again.

Dave

Well hopefully this afternoon the weather will cooperate enough (no rain) so I can get in there and work on some of the wiring issues. I'll check and see if I can get the video working. Otherwise I'm thinking its a hardware problem on the unit itself.

I had purchased the JVC KW-NX7000 unit. GPS navigation is the most important part of the unit for me. So I returned it immediately when a JVC supervisor confirmed that the unit does NOT have "dead reckoning" capabilities.

When there is a loss of GPS signal (driving through a tunnel or surrounded by tall buildings), dead reckoning employs the use of an internal gyroscope and a connection to the vehicle's speed sensor in order to keep the vehicle pin-pointed on the map. This significantly improves accuracy. The gyroscope tells the unit what direction you're heading and if you're turning, and the speed sensor connection of course tells the unit how fast you're traveling.

$200 windshield mount units do not have dead reckoning capabilities. All factory units, and many aftermarket in-dash units, have dead reckoning. Sadly, the KW-NX7000 nav capabilities are no better than your average $200 windshield-mount unit.

Now I am considering Pioneer's AVIC-F900BT. This unit does indeed have 'dead reckoning'. But I'm still not sure I want to wait 2 minutes everytime I turn the ignition!

I am reading that there are varying boot-up times depending on your preferences. Can someone out there time how long it takes to boot up after ignition with JUST the radio or CD music as the default (no SD card in the slot, no Ipod connection at all, no Satellite radio, no backup cam)?

Under the above scenario, can someone tell me exactly how many seconds after turning the key before you hear music AND can control it-- ability to either change radio stations, or change the CD track?

Before I purchase, I also need to know exactly how many seconds elapse after I turn the ignition before I can fully use the GPS navigation (enter a destination and get going).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!