Honestly this should be going passed our differences. I feel like that little kid telling people not to fight. The truth is that with out someone being pissed about some performance we wouldn't have standards to go by at all.

If it weren't for people pointing out the flaws of the unit when it was first released, if it weren't for those early adopters of this product, I wouldn't have known to wait. I personally was saved a big head ache and a big hassle by waiting for something like 2.0 to come.

Who cares who trumped the others hack. Competition breads improvement and change. The bottom line is that Tacoma helped us out and everyone who has ever said that something sucks might have sounded annoying but that one comment might have been exactly what someone else needed to hear to stop and think.. "hey this shit does suck! why the fuck did I pay $1200 bucks for this".

Pioneer is the real bad guy in here. These units were hyped to all fucking hell and they not only failed once but they failed over and over again.

Ok I'm done being the lets all be friends guy. Fuck all of you for making me type this and thank you all for allowing me to make an educated choice.

I'll be putting 3.0 on my unit tomorrow and seeing how it works. Should I call pioneer and tell them I don't want to buy their copy?

there is a small chance that there is a subtle difference between the X's and the F's lets' at least wait until someone gets the official "F" 3.0 upgrade..... id leave it on order......

question...... is there documentation that says that everything hardwarewise, even the mb (motherboard), is the same..... they could have differences that changes how the software functions ... I am grasping here, but it would seem that pioneer would do more than just "change the clothes" and call them new units, thus copying the hardrive from one type to the other may not be 100% compatible..... thoughts...

Honestly this should be going passed our differences. I feel like that little kid telling people not to fight. The truth is that with out someone being pissed about some performance we wouldn't have standards to go by at all.

If it weren't for people pointing out the flaws of the unit when it was first released, if it weren't for those early adopters of this product, I wouldn't have known to wait. I personally was saved a big head ache and a big hassle by waiting for something like 2.0 to come.

Who cares who trumped the others hack. Competition breads improvement and change. The bottom line is that Tacoma helped us out and everyone who has ever said that something sucks might have sounded annoying but that one comment might have been exactly what someone else needed to hear to stop and think.. "hey this shit does suck! why the fuck did I pay $1200 bucks for this".

Pioneer is the real bad guy in here. These units were hyped to all fucking hell and they not only failed once but they failed over and over again.

Ok I'm done being the lets all be friends guy. Fuck all of you for making me type this and thank you all for allowing me to make an educated choice.

 

I'll be putting 3.0 on my unit tomorrow and seeing how it works. Should I call pioneer and tell them I don't want to buy their copy?

there is a small chance that there is a subtle difference between the X's and the F's lets' at least wait until someone gets the official "F" 3.0 upgrade..... id leave it on order......

 

question...... is there documentation that says that everything hardwarewise, even the mb (motherboard), is the same..... they could have differences that changes how the software functions ... I am grasping here, but it would seem that pioneer would do more than just "change the clothes" and call them new units, thus coping the hardrive from one type to the other may not be 100% compatible..... thoughts...

The 3.0101 software works on my AVIC-F900bt with no mods or hacks necessary. Any hardware changes are insignificant. Someone mentioned an Apple ecoding chip and 5V output. But the X software works (as well as it can, I suppose).

is that a us deck or an eu deck?

is that a us deck or an eu deck?

U.S.

ok thanks

have a look at the Clarion Navigation decks with internal HD

have a look at the Clarion Navigation decks with internal HD

Clarion? Any specific models? I am going to see if any shops in town have the JVC KW-NT1 so I can beat on it some.

He,s right pioneer avic units are a piece of shit i pulled avic f90bt unit out of my car and installed the eclipse gps avn76d way better unit everything works good with this unit, I can,t believe people are still holding on to their false hopes for the pioneer avic.

He,s right pioneer avic units are a piece of shit i pulled avic f90bt unit out of my car and installed the eclipse gps avn76d way better unit everything works good with this unit, I can,t believe people are still holding on to their false hopes for the pioneer avic.

How do you like that Eclipse, I was considering the avn76e, but the JVC has streaming bluetooth audio and is cheaper which is good. The videos all make it look pretty solid, but I am gonna find one in store, pair it to my ipod, phone, etc and really use it first.

- bootup time

- slow menus and button responses

I agree with these.

- bluetooth - hangs for 50 seconds after most calls

I have had occasional problems but very limited and seems to be better with the 2.006.

- the reverse camera takes 10 seconds to come on after starting the car

Not using a reverse camera at present but this would not be an issue for me, I can wait.

- ipod VR mode sucks - I have to go through the menu to turn it on and off again. Good lord how hard is it to add a small icon in the corner of the ipod source interface that would initiate this process without having to go through crap load of menus?!?!

I am not using an ipod so no issues for me - I do sympathize for you ipod users.

- when I am in the settings and I press the upper left corner, it takes me to the source selection rather than the actual source

Not really an issue for me but interface could be smarter.

- the fader/balancer is slowwww

- the EQ settings customization is slowwwwwwww

Never found this to be an issue. I pretty much set my settings then forget it. Rarely ever change anything.

- selection of songs in SD, the selection of XM radio channels, the selection of artists or genres via ipod are all painfully slow

- I cant actually SEE what song is currently on when in ipod/SD/XM mode and in song/preset selection mode. This has got to be the stupidest UI decision EVER. Why should I have to toggle back and forth between modes just to see who is playing, and use the preset mode?

I don't have XM or ipod but I do find it stupid that while listening to the radio I have to keep changing the disp mode to go between station name display, artist name and song name. Why can't we have them all scrool or have multiple lines of info?

- trying to initiate a phone call within 30 seconds of bootup - currently my system "reboots", then takes 2 minutes to finish booting, and ends up putting me in the phone call menu. Just press the button after 10 seconds, or 15 seconds, and it freaks out.

I can wait for the system to boot up, but I never had a problem with the system rebooting when trying to use the phone. I have had a couple of random reboots though.

- takes 2 minutes to connect to the phone

Not an issue for me.

- turn the car off while on a phone call, takes who knows how long for the phone to kick over to handset mode. My wife's OEM system takes 2 seconds, if that.

Another non issue for me. I never noticed the time lag. I don't talk on the phone a lot. My phone stays in a belt holster. I just shut the car off and walk away.

- When you reach your fucking destination, the damn thing wont end the route automatically! After it says your destination has been reached it needs to STFU.

Mine unit usually ends the route if it realizes I am at my destination although many times it does not realize I am in the right place since gps is sometimes off slightly due to a destination like some store being off the road a bit.

- It randomly decides to automatically set the route to home, for no reason whatsoever when you turn it on! This may be hard to test since it does it only once a month or so. You know it has happened if you turn it on and before the screen pops up it tells you to take your next left.

Nevr had this happen in the four plus months I have had my unit. Sounds like a bad unit to me.

- The ipod randomly connects when you turn it on. I get about a 60% connect rate despite a brand new cable, and perfectly good ipod touch. Restarting the car is the fix for this. Well after driving for 30 seconds and realizing it didnt connect.

Again I don't have an ipod, but this does seem to be a problem from other post I have read.

- OH! If the voice recognition does not understand you, it say "WHATWASIT?" That drives me nuts

It is voice recognition and it is not perfect. I have had cell phones that sucked at this too.

- Samantha in general just sucks.

I agree. There are many other voices there but for some reason Pioneer did not enable them. I notice quite a few different vioce files while I was watching my 2.006 update.

- the bluetooth randomly sets call volume. Sometimes a call is blaringly loud, sometimes I cant hear the caller at all, and sometimes the frigging controls for volume don't even show up!! Sometimes the music continues in the background (at full volume) and sometimes not.

I never had bluetooth volume issues. I am on my second F7010BT though because bluetooth quit working on my first one.

These are just the ones off the top of my head

My main complaints are as follows:

1. Slow response

2. Occasional lockups

3. Poor interface without choice of different color schemes on map screen. (Can be fixed through mods but should be available options)

4. HD module does not show station present info. (UNACCEPTABLE)

5. No nav voice mute. (Fix by mod only)

6. Clock on Radio screen is so small it is almost unusable.

7. Stock clock on nav screen is hard to read at times. (Another mod only fix)

8. Speed cam should be available without mod.

9. Not being able to chose the type of route I want to set at the time of inputting the route, such as choosing Fast, Avoid Highways, etc. at route time instead of have to go through a bunch of menus and change routing selections. If anyone has every used a Hertz Magellan system you will know how it should be. If you have not used one or any other good system rent a Hertz car with nav for one day to try it.

I might be able to think of some more but I don't want to at this time. Even with these fault I think it is a pretty nice unit for the price I paid.

I might be able to think of some more but I don't want to at this time. Even with these fault I think it is a pretty nice unit for the price I paid.

but that is the problem...some of us paid 1200 for our units, others paid 400. you might feel like you got a good deal but others, like tacomaboy, feel betrayed.

Had I paid 400 for the 900bt i would be upset but not betrayed, but I paid 900 bucks for this thing and for what? A shitty nav system, ipod problems, MSN that does not work and has not worked since the second week, and shitty bluetooth. Im sorry but that is unacceptable.

Well, I see the way you are doing the 3.0 update as a HACKED version myself, you took the firmware of the X series and put it into your F series..... hmmm sounds like a hack to me. We don't fully know what really has been fixed on the F series firmware untill the update comes out. like others have stated, the X series might have hardware parts (updated or just diff chipsets) then th F series that might not allow the f series take full advantage of the X series firmware, BUt the f series 3.0 update might have the fixes in it that work better with our hardware.

As for the LONG list of problems you listed, well I have not had ALOT of those issues, and others arn't as bad as other units i have used in the part. Like the issue of the navi not stopping after reaching destination, I have only had that happen ONCE, every other time it works like it should, I have never had the issue of it directing me "home" right from the start UNLESS i have already activated it before i shut the car off (like i stopped for food), but IMHO thats what it supposed to do. Bluetooth used to give me the most issues, that was untill i for my Palm Pre, now it works GREAT!!!! I only had the issue of the 50 sec hang one time since i got my new phone. Ever call sound about the same in volume and my audio going out to them sound great (except when the microphone fell back into the dash a little bit messing up the line-of-sight to my mouth and that made it sound hollow and caused the other people to hear alot of background noise). YES the start up time is REALLY SLOW and the lag on the button/screen hits are bad, but the latter of the 2 has been fixed in 3.0 and that was my biggest issue with it now.

I might be able to think of some more but I don't want to at this time. Even with these fault I think it is a pretty nice unit for the price I paid.

 

but that is the problem...some of us paid 1200 for our units, others paid 400. you might feel like you got a good deal but others, like tacomaboy, feel betrayed.

 

Had I paid 400 for the 900bt i would be upset but not betrayed, but I paid 900 bucks for this thing and for what? A shitty nav system, ipod problems, MSN that does not work and has not worked since the second week, and shitty bluetooth. Im sorry but that is unacceptable.

Yep thats my problem. I guess if I paid 400 bucks I wouldn't be too pissed, especially with all the reviews out there saying how bad it can be. But I bought it on faith that Pioneer would make a great product, and I really feel betrayed that:

A: Pioneer released a very bad product

B: Pioneer made promises it couldnt/wouldnt keep (namely if you watched the videos of the unit as I did you had a high expectation).

C: Pioneer failed to release timely fixes to these problems

D: Pioneer is trying to charge users for fixes.

Well, I see the way you are doing the 3.0 update as a HACKED version myself, you took the firmware of the X series and put it into your F series..... hmmm sounds like a hack to me. We don't fully know what really has been fixed on the F series firmware untill the update comes out. like others have stated, the X series might have hardware parts (updated or just diff chipsets) then th F series that might not allow the f series take full advantage of the X series firmware, BUt the f series 3.0 update might have the fixes in it that work better with our hardware.

 

As for the LONG list of problems you listed, well I have not had ALOT of those issues, and others arn't as bad as other units i have used in the part. Like the issue of the navi not stopping after reaching destination, I have only had that happen ONCE, every other time it works like it should, I have never had the issue of it directing me "home" right from the start UNLESS i have already activated it before i shut the car off (like i stopped for food), but IMHO thats what it supposed to do. Bluetooth used to give me the most issues, that was untill i for my Palm Pre, now it works GREAT!!!! I only had the issue of the 50 sec hang one time since i got my new phone. Ever call sound about the same in volume and my audio going out to them sound great (except when the microphone fell back into the dash a little bit messing up the line-of-sight to my mouth and that made it sound hollow and caused the other people to hear alot of background noise). YES the start up time is REALLY SLOW and the lag on the button/screen hits are bad, but the latter of the 2 has been fixed in 3.0 and that was my biggest issue with it now.

Well, to me, a Software Engineer with a Masters in Software Engineering and 8 years experience under my belt, a hack is defined as a software modification in order to bypass certain features.

I did not modify any software at all, so no hack. but to each there own.

You are welcome to pay Pioneer for what they should have given for free if you want. If you are happy with yours then clearly you have lower standards than I (and others) do. Not a problem, keep your unit. I am moving on.

I think the problem is, there are too many people taking MINOR MINOR issues and making them sound like they are the end of the world.

I guess youll have that no matter where you go, there is always somebody not happy because something doesnt work the way THEY think it should.

My F700BT is fantastic now after the full 3.0 update... and I use an iPod every day... wow big deal I have to enable VR scanning in the settings screen then once in a blue moon I update my iPod, I am not going to come cry about it. For $300 it was well well worth it.

I might be able to think of some more but I don't want to at this time. Even with these fault I think it is a pretty nice unit for the price I paid.

 

but that is the problem...some of us paid 1200 for our units, others paid 400. you might feel like you got a good deal but others, like tacomaboy, feel betrayed.

 

Had I paid 400 for the 900bt i would be upset but not betrayed, but I paid 900 bucks for this thing and for what? A shitty nav system, ipod problems, MSN that does not work and has not worked since the second week, and shitty bluetooth. Im sorry but that is unacceptable.

i have the same problem. i paid more then £800 for it... so if some dude tells here well if you don't like it then just selll it, just talks !"£$%^&. if i dump this deck on ebay i might get £400 or may be £450 for it. so that's why i hold on and try to make the best of it.

Well, to me, a Software Engineer with a Masters in Software Engineering and 8 years experience under my belt, a hack is defined as a software modification in order to bypass certain features.

I did not modify any software at all, so no hack. but to each there own.

You are welcome to pay Pioneer for what they should have given for free if you want. If you are happy with yours then clearly you have lower standards than I (and others) do. Not a problem, keep your unit. I am moving on.

quoted for truth!

I think the problem is, there are too many people taking MINOR MINOR issues and making them sound like they are the end of the world.

 

I guess youll have that no matter where you go, there is always somebody not happy because something doesnt work the way THEY think it should.

 

My F700BT is fantastic now after the full 3.0 update... and I use an iPod every day... wow big deal I have to enable VR scanning in the settings screen then once in a blue moon I update my iPod, I am not going to come cry about it. For $300 it was well well worth it.

Its all relative of course. Maybe I am super picky, maybe you are very laid back.

I did not pay 300 bucks though. I paid over 1000, and have had to live with lots of problems for a year, it gets to you.

Having to turn the VR on, wait for it to cycle, then go back and turn it off every time I add a song, gets really tiring after a while.

And some of us use it differently, I add music pretty often.

For example, some people think 10Second reverse camera is ok. However, I get in the car and buckle. THEN I start the car, and put it into reverse. In a parking lot, with someone waiting for you to back out, 10 seconds is forever, even at home in the garage I have to sit there for 10 seconds picking my nose waiting for my camera to come on like some kind of tool. Count to 10 slowly, and imagine sitting there in your car. Now do it 3 or 4 times a day for a year. I want my 900 seconds of life back.

- unit switches to NAV when a call is placed or received

Well, to be honest I wouldn't call this a bug

Because when you are using navigation while e.g. watching a DVD (means: no map on the screen) and someone calls you, then the voice of the navigation will get muted - and if the unit wouldn't change back to the map mode, you wouldn't know where to drive to, because you have *no* voice out of the navigation system (muted by the phone call) and *no* view to the map, because the DVD is still runing.

Of course, a parameter switch would be nice to steer that behavior - but I wouldn't call it a bug on the first hand...

Bye,

Boby

- unit switches to NAV when a call is placed or received

Well, to be honest I wouldn't call this a bug

Because when you are using navigation while e.g. watching a DVD (means: no map on the screen) and someone calls you, then the voice of the navigation will get muted - and if the unit wouldn't change back to the map mode, you wouldn't know where to drive to, because you have *no* voice out of the navigation system (muted by the phone call) and *no* view to the map, because the DVD is still runing.

 

Of course, a parameter switch would be nice to steer that behavior - but I wouldn't call it a bug on the first hand...

 

Bye,

Boby

I think it is a bug, having worked in Software Development for so long I guarantee QA would write me up a ticket for a poor feature like this. Requirements and Design can have defects as well.

For example, some people think 10Second reverse camera is ok. However, I get in the car and buckle. THEN I start the car, and put it into reverse.

Funny... if I do that, camera comes on instantly. It's only if I go into reverse when it is in the middle of boot-up that I have to wait.

i only play podcasts so every sunday i load new podcasts via itunes, so my VR is always on as i only listen those podcasts once.

bluetooth... it's a total joke in compare with the kenwood in my wifes vehicle. no sms text, bad sound quality, lots of drops / disconnects, no way to listen to you voice box (can't type dtmf), slow responce (ever tried to use the deck while on the phone or playing a dvd), doesn't pause the audio (just mute it so i miss my podcasts when on the phone), no auto update of your contacts.

just to name a couple problems. and yes i tried it with the same phone as i tested on the kenwood...

For example, some people think 10Second reverse camera is ok. However, I get in the car and buckle. THEN I start the car, and put it into reverse.

 

Funny... if I do that, camera comes on instantly. It's only if I go into reverse when it is in the middle of boot-up that I have to wait.

Ahh if its already booted, then it takes mayb 3 seconds which is not so bad. But 99% of the time, the car is turned off before I kick it into reverse.

Well, at least I can't follow directions with neither map on the screen nor spoken instructions.

So, I'm pretty happy the device switches to the map view during a phone call.