buskeyl Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Hello folks.. First off, what a killer resource you guys are! I have been dying to get one of these things, but I am a systems engineer, and just naturally need to know more before I can spend this kind of scratch. Bravo Zulu for the foks that made this happen. First off, how true is the statement that this unit is "Upgradable" That is to say that future innovations, features and fixes can be applied to the chassis of the Z1, because the operating system and software is just that, software. Or will I need a new one in three years cause the 2008 AVIC units do all kinds of cool stuff the Z1 cannot do? 1. I wish to install in a 03 Tahoe LT with the factory Bose system. Cruthfield's little online dammit says it will not fit, my own measurements and locall deals say it will, no cutting required. Can I get some feedback on a Tahoe install? 2. My loacal dealer says the only steering wheel interface module is infrared, so you have to mount a tiny IR emmiter to control the Z1. Is there not a digital solution? 3. I take it that as of now, current units have no bypass capbility? The flasher thingy has been removed or otherwise enforced by Panasonic? I think DucatiBoy is in the middle of attempting to reverse enginner a new unit? What is the exact month I need to have in order to use the flasher mod? 4. Is the bluetooth module capabile of interfacing other bluetooth devices besides a phone? For example, I use a Windows mobile device extensively now for GPS, Spoken audio and some other stuff. I'd like to be able to continue to use the Dell Axim for audible.com spoken audio. I can hard wire it to an aux input like I do now with the factory stereo, but Bluetooh would be nice. If the answer to this is yes, can it pair and use a phone and a handheld at the same time. 5. Regarding Ducati's bypass, presuming I can find an older model, does the bypass also affect the limits imposed on bluetooth operation? 6. I read the HDD FAQ, but did not see tan answer to this. I know the Z1 cannot directly copy MP3 to the HDD< which is a truely horrible oversight, but it can and does copt standard autio to the HDD. Does it make MP3's? If so, is it possible to hok the Z1 HDD to your computer (I know that can be done) and then just dump a crapload of mp3's on there, and have them available for playback? 7. I read a complaint on CNet about the actual QUALITY of the audio the Z1 copies for diskless playback. Is this really an issue? 8. Is it possibe to wire the rear camera so you can see the image anytime? Or only when actually in reverse. Sorry for so many questions, probably have more later too... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PaisanNYC Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 I dont own a Z1, I own an N3, but I think I can answer some of these based on what Ive read here before. [quote name="buskeyl"]3. I take it that as of now, current units have no bypass capbility? The flasher thingy has been removed or otherwise enforced by Panasonic? I think DucatiBoy is in the middle of attempting to reverse enginner a new unit? What is the exact month I need to have in order to use the flasher mod? [b]To be on the safe side, June 06 or before[/b] 4. Is the bluetooth module capabile of interfacing other bluetooth devices besides a phone? For example, I use a Windows mobile device extensively now for GPS, Spoken audio and some other stuff. I'd like to be able to continue to use the Dell Axim for audible.com spoken audio. I can hard wire it to an aux input like I do now with the factory stereo, but Bluetooh would be nice. If the answer to this is yes, can it pair and use a phone and a handheld at the same time. [b]No only bluetooth phones. I believe only OBEX capable bluetooth phones, which means some Verizon phones that VZW purposely crippled the OBEX feature would not work fully.[/b] 6. I read the HDD FAQ, but did not see tan answer to this. I know the Z1 cannot directly copy MP3 to the HDD< which is a truely horrible oversight, but it can and does copt standard autio to the HDD. Does it make MP3's? If so, is it possible to hok the Z1 HDD to your computer (I know that can be done) and then just dump a crapload of mp3's on there, and have them available for playback? [b]The files created on the HDD are not mp3, but some other lower quality (I cannot remember which right now.) I dont think anyone has been TRUELY successful connecting the HDD to a PC, Linux, or Mac box and transfer files yet. Hopefully this will be corrected soon.[/b] 8. Is it possibe to wire the rear camera so you can see the image anytime? Or only when actually in reverse. [b]Yes. This is definitely possible. This is helpful especially when towing things, so you can have a continuos eye on it.[/b] Sorry for so many questions, probably have more later too...[/quote] Hope this can help! And if Im wrong, please someone correct me! LOL :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mlbz28 Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 As far as the 03 Tahoe, I put one in a 02 tahoe. I just snapped an 04 dash bezel onto my 02 dash. Fits fine. I think the 03 dash is a double din unit also so it should work. As far as the bose interface I'm sure someone makes one for it. There is an option on the map menu to select rear camera view. I use it all the time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ducatiboy Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 [quote name="buskeyl"]Hello folks.. First off, what a killer resource you guys are! I have been dying to get one of these things, but I am a systems engineer, and just naturally need to know more before I can spend this kind of scratch. Bravo Zulu for the foks that made this happen. First off, how true is the statement that this unit is "Upgradable" That is to say that future innovations, features and fixes can be applied to the chassis of the Z1, because the operating system and software is just that, software. Or will I need a new one in three years cause the 2008 AVIC units do all kinds of cool stuff the Z1 cannot do?[/quote] The software can be updated, but it's anyone's guess how much. They have already put out a gracenote update and that's pretty painless and from what people report there are lots of song updates in it. [quote name="buskeyl"] 2. My loacal dealer says the only steering wheel interface module is infrared, so you have to mount a tiny IR emmiter to control the Z1. Is there not a digital solution?[/quote] Nope he is wrong. Look at the Pac Audio SWI-PS. No IR needed. It's hard wired. I have one and it works very well. [quote name="buskeyl"]3. I take it that as of now, current units have no bypass capbility? The flasher thingy has been removed or otherwise enforced by Panasonic? I think DucatiBoy is in the middle of attempting to reverse enginner a new unit? What is the exact month I need to have in order to use the flasher mod?[/quote] I'm working on it. I was hoping for something more obvious, but nothing so far. To be absolutely safe... May 06 and before. June 06 you have a very good chance, but I have heard of one report of a June 06 not working, but that could be user/installation error. [quote name="buskeyl"] 4. Is the bluetooth module capabile of interfacing other bluetooth devices besides a phone? For example, I use a Windows mobile device extensively now for GPS, Spoken audio and some other stuff. I'd like to be able to continue to use the Dell Axim for audible.com spoken audio. I can hard wire it to an aux input like I do now with the factory stereo, but Bluetooh would be nice. If the answer to this is yes, can it pair and use a phone and a handheld at the same time.[/quote] No just a phone, and not smart phones either. I think it's only headset protocol. [quote name="buskeyl"] 5. Regarding Ducati's bypass, presuming I can find an older model, does the bypass also affect the limits imposed on bluetooth operation?[/quote] Absolutely everything that's available while stopped is available while in motion... absolutely everything. [quote name="buskeyl"] 6. I read the HDD FAQ, but did not see tan answer to this. I know the Z1 cannot directly copy MP3 to the HDD< which is a truely horrible oversight, but it can and does copt standard autio to the HDD. Does it make MP3's? If so, is it possible to hok the Z1 HDD to your computer (I know that can be done) and then just dump a crapload of mp3's on there, and have them available for playback?[/quote] Well for you and I it's a horrible oversight. For the music industry they love it. They want us to spend $ on the CD, and then again for MP3 and again for whatever format is next. They do not want us making MP3's out of CD's we have purchased because there is "too much" we can do with it. The Z1 makes AT3 files I believe. And we have hacked the hard drive (I actually changed the boot up logo). But not only does it make something other than MP3's but it creates a whole directory structure and other files (like playlist files) which are required for the Z1 to see the music. So in order to "copy mp3's" to the hard drive... you would need to set up a driectory structure on your pc, then run a program that would convert the mp3's to what ever format the Z1 uses and then put them in the specific directories, and then create the extra files needed for the Z1 to know the songs are there... then copy the new directories made to the hard drive on the Z1. All these are possible, but the program to do this has not been done, cause the hard drive needs to be unlocked for about $50. [quote name="buskeyl"]7. I read a complaint on CNet about the actual QUALITY of the audio the Z1 copies for diskless playback. Is this really an issue?[/quote] I think they sound just fine. But my cousin will complain that I'm not an audiophile. He thinks that if you spend less then $10K on a home receiver (just the receiver) then the music playing is like finger nails on a chauk board. He spent $5K each for his speakers too. His stereo gets louder than mine ($500 sony, Infinity speakers $500 pair) but I think mine sounds great. He says it pains him to listen to his cd's on my system. So take my aproval with a grain of salt. [quote name="buskeyl"] 8. Is it possibe to wire the rear camera so you can see the image anytime? Or only when actually in reverse.[/quote] Actually there is a "map" mode which will put 2/3 on the backup camera and 1/3 on the map. [quote name="buskeyl"] Sorry for so many questions, probably have more later too...[/quote] Fire them on.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niteone Posted August 21, 2006 Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 "No just a phone, and not smart phones either. I think it's only headset protocol. " no, the PPC-6700 is a smart phone (Sprint) and it works perfectly with the bluetooth in the avic-z1. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ducatiboy Posted August 21, 2006 Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 [quote name="niteone"]"No just a phone, and not smart phones either. I think it's only headset protocol. " no, the PPC-6700 is a smart phone (Sprint) and it works perfectly with the bluetooth in the avic-z1.[/quote] Well in general pioneer says that the Z1 was not meant to work with smart phones, and most don't work, but if you have one that does, count yourself lucky. But you are more of an exception than the rule I believe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buskeyl Posted August 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 OK, now for feature questions. I am trying to make sure the Z1 is all that I need. The lack of imbedded HD radio bothers me. HD radio is free, but I don’t know much about who's broadcasting HD radio yet. Should I worry about this, or will it be simple to add on later if I need it? Seem like a lot of other models are supporting it. What exactly does the IPOD adapter do for me? Are there pictures of the interface somewhere? I am a Windows Mobile guy, but I am seeing the Ipod as a possible way to get over this ridiculous limitation of not being able to use the Z1 HDD for MP3's. Do any of you installers/Dealers out there have time to post a good comparison of the Z1, versus the Eclipse AVN 5495 versus the Alpine Advanced DVD Navigation System with their pulse-touch head unit? These seem to be the players to me... It occurs to me I can solve all of these problems with the HDD and Aux input, and DVD video with a modded X-box installed in the truck. I could then FTP music and Video (Divx, Xvid, whatever) from my P/C in the house to the Truck out at the Curb via Wi-Fi. Anyone out there have any advice for mounting an X-box (Non-360) to a vehicle? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lcstyle Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 [quote name="buskeyl"] It occurs to me I can solve all of these problems with the HDD and Aux input, and DVD video with a modded X-box installed in the truck. I could then FTP music and Video (Divx, Xvid, whatever) from my P/C in the house to the Truck out at the Curb via Wi-Fi. Anyone out there have any advice for mounting an X-box (Non-360) to a vehicle?[/quote] genius idea. thanks. try mp3car.com forums for installing the xbox in the car. it'd be interesting to install a switch or a portable in car wireless gateway with a sprint evdo card, that way you can have wireless internet anywhere you go, and then also have a RJ45 connection where you can plug your laptop into so that you can transfer files directly to the xbox. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
03Aviator Posted August 24, 2006 Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 [quote name="buskeyl"] It occurs to me I can solve all of these problems with the HDD and Aux input, and DVD video with a modded X-box installed in the truck. I could then FTP music and Video (Divx, Xvid, whatever) from my P/C in the house to the Truck out at the Curb via Wi-Fi. Anyone out there have any advice for mounting an X-box (Non-360) to a vehicle?[/quote] That is EXACTLY what my son is putting together for his car. Except he's not using an X box...he's using a laptop. It will be networked to his home stuff for any and all updates. He'll even have internet access while driving down the road. Right now, he's working on finding the screen he wants. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cirbirus Posted August 24, 2006 Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 [quote name="buskeyl"]7. I read a complaint on CNet about the actual QUALITY of the audio the Z1 copies for diskless playback. Is this really an issue?[/quote] The problem with quality is when you take MP3's (or any other lossy compressed audio) and burn them to an Audio CD then rip them from that Audio CD to the Z1. When you burn the MP3's to an audio CD they do not magically regain all the clarity you lost when converting to MP3's in the first place, you lost that, that's why it's call a lossy compression. Then you compress the audio again, thus losing even more clarity, which ends up making your audio sound like it's coming from the bottom of a well. Of course if you have lossless compressed files, e.g. FLAC, then it won't be an issue as the audio CD burned from the lossless files will sound exactly like the original. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
branas Posted August 24, 2006 Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 What exactly does the IPOD adapter do for me? Are there pictures of the interface somewhere? I am a Windows Mobile guy, but I am seeing the Ipod as a possible way to get over this ridiculous limitation of not being able to use the Z1 HDD for MP3's. [img]http://www.branas.org/truck/Z1-IpodInterface.jpg[/img] Snapped you a pic. The Ipod adapter does EVERYTHING for you. I have seen alot of complaints on here about the speed of the interface. I really don't have a problem with it (we're talking about maybe a half a second you have to wait when scrolling through artists, 5 at a time) I'm just glad that it actually WORKS, and works well. The ipod itself can be a bit sluggish to begin with. I would absolutely without a doubt never install this system and try and use the ipod externally through an aux in or something, the integrated controls are really nice, IMHO. I have the ipod in the glove box and I never have to touch it unless I bring it inside to sync with iTunes or something. I have stored 1 CD on the HDD, and the quality seems fine on the Bose system, which is a decent system, not a truly high-end system. I did rip from the original CD though, take heed the advice from the gentleman who stated that you shouldn't burn your mp3's to disc just to have the Z1 rip them again. Try and burn uncompressed audio and let it rip that, you will get a better rip. BTW, as you may have seen by now, Ducatiboy has discovered the bypass for the new units now, so that is no longer an issue. I cannot tell you about the other units navigation capabilities. But I can tell you this, I used to drive around with a laptop running streets & trips and this thing blows that away, the dynamic, intelligent re-routing, the ETA display, multiple map views, 3d views, the way they've integrated the POI's, the addressbook, it's all great. I'm really impressed with this unit, more impressed that I thought I would be. "It occurs to me I can solve all of these problems with the HDD and Aux input, and DVD video with a modded X-box installed in the truck. I could then FTP music and Video (Divx, Xvid, whatever) from my P/C in the house to the Truck out at the Curb via Wi-Fi. Anyone out there have any advice for mounting an X-box (Non-360) to a vehicle?" Ipod. Not to discourage the Xbox thing 'cause I think that would be cool. I will second the suggestion of going to mp3car.com forums for suggestions on installing the Xbox. I'm adding a computer behind the rear seat, maybe an Xbox at some point, but the computer with cellmodem come first! I just cannot imagine an interface working cleaner than with the ipod, with the one exception being that it could be a little faster, when you are looking for a specific artist, shuffle mode does not seem any slower than the ipod by itself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buskeyl Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 [quote]The problem with quality is when you take MP3's (or any other lossy compressed audio) and burn them to an Audio CD then rip them from that Audio CD to the Z1. When you burn the MP3's to an audio CD they do not magically regain all the clarity you lost when converting to MP3's in the first place, you lost that, that's why it's call a lossy compression. Then you compress the audio again, thus losing even more clarity, which ends up making your audio sound like it's coming from the bottom of a well. [/quote] This is an excellent point. Thank you very much. I'll bet this is exactly what was the case on the post I read. Unfortunately, this is also how I had planned to get much of my music on the AVIC. The Ipod looks good. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buskeyl Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2006 [quote] Snapped you a pic. The Ipod adapter does EVERYTHING for you. I have seen alot of complaints on here about the speed of the interface. [/quote] Thanks so much for the very complete answer! I had not seen there was a new bypass. That helps. Does the Ipod interface also charge the Ipod? I went to MP3car.com. IMFG! :shock: I am a Wndows systems engineer by trade, and I had no idea the scene had developed to the level it has. I may very well have to go that route. Right now I am trying to imagine if I can do both, I suspect it'll be too costly / redundant. I am quite literally gettig consumed by reading all the stuff here and there to see what the deal... I did have a life last week... :wink: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
branas Posted August 25, 2006 Report Share Posted August 25, 2006 Yes, the adapter keeps the ipod charged at all times. I got really into the mp3car thing for awhile also, and there is alot to be desired in having the PC, and they seem to have alot of really well developed pieces of hardware and software. I decided in the end though that first and foremost I want a *reliable* unit that won't have driver issues, etc. from time to time. I have worked in IT for 10+ years so I understand your desire to go the carputer route. I decided to add the carputer as a secondary a/v input into the Z1. My .02 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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