rjnebbo Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Hi guys, just had the F900BT installed professionally and when I picked it up the Check Engine Light (CEL) came on along with the Anti-Slip light. (No Modes done... Yet) It came on just driving it about 50 feet, so they never drove it! Anyway, after verifying that the correct wires were hooked up (Purple) for VSS on vehicle the "Tech" ended up leaving the wire disconnected saying that there must be some sort of feedback which may require some sort of additional diode to be installed... and that Toyota must have changed something somewhere...Maybe, that is. They told me you really do not need it anyway, as the Nav will recalculate after you go through a tunnel, etc... I told them then why did I pay more for this one then? Answer you get the DVD... I was late to where I had to be so I left the shop the way it was and told them I would be back. I want it to work... I have a feeling that the Limited Slip function is tied into the VSS system and may be the problem. However, if so what is the fix? The installer said that a diode is suppose to already built into the unit to prevent this kind of thing... so maybe a modification is in order. I want to see what you guys think. And what do you think the fix might be? Your input is most appreciated Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CamelTowing Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 I think they probably tapped or cut the wrong wire. The VSS is simple to find on that car and shouldn't cause any warning lights if they hooked it up right Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jrdiesel Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 2009 Rav 4 VSS = Purple @ Radio Harness (Except with JBL System) For JBL Systems, wire is in Passenger Kick, Bottom White Plug. Or at the amplifier in the rear passenger quarter panel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rjnebbo Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 2009 Rav 4 VSS = Purple @ Radio Harness (Except with JBL System) For JBL Systems, wire is in Passenger Kick, Bottom White Plug. Or at the amplifier in the rear passenger quarter panel. Yup... This DID NOT have the JBL System, so they used the Purple wire @ Radio Harness, I saw this for myself when I returned for them to see what the problem was Good to know though about if it did have JBL. I agree it should not cause a problem if hooked up right, I saw where and how they hooked it up and it was a Purple wire, in fact there was another smaller harness that had a Purple wire as well that was not plugged into anything and they thought maybe it was that one, however the same problem resulted when they used that one. They then did a continuity check on both those Purple wires and they had continuity (meaning they are the same wire/circuit). I was thinking that maybe I will remove the unit and actually check what type of voltage I get from that purple wire while driving. I would think this is going to be a AC type voltage. Any ideas as to what voltage reading I should see and what scale? AC or DC? Yeah I know most components are generally DC on a vehicle, but there are some sensors that create AC sign waves rather than DC. The other thing I suppose to check would be that of the VSS circuit being faulty, but I doubt that, being a brand new vehicle and the checks they have in place for this would have set a code. I wonder if that Pink wire from the NAV unit goes defective what happens? Supply GND? SO Does this wire from the NAV unit have a GND or POS reference... hummm Bad NAV unit??? Come to think of it, my speak recognition does not work at all correctly with my Bluetooth Imported Contact Phone Book. It will either not recognize the command or just dial some random 3 digit number or some other random full number not even in my contact list!!! However the other speak recognition parts work, like going from FM to XM. Just Phone book. I even tried adding another Bluetooth phone and importing those contacts but get same results. The first phone was a Blackberry, but the other was a Nokia phone. This would probably be another thread/topic, however I mention it only if there is some correlation between this and the VSS indicating a problem with the NAV unit???? What steps do you guys think I should take to trouble shoot? and what voltages and scale should I see? I have a FLuke 88 meter to test with I guess I could get a separate VSS kit, but I should not have to do that. Thanks so far for the input!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jrdiesel Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 The signal will be AC for sure. The exact measurements, I don't recall though. I have the info in a binder at home, I will check after work if you haven't figured it out yet. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rjnebbo Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 The signal will be AC for sure. The exact measurements, I don't recall though. I have the info in a binder at home, I will check after work if you haven't figured it out yet. Thanks so much for the help! I called Pioneer on this and they say they can't help and to have the installing shop figure it out. So I will need that information you have at home if you don't mind Thanks a lot! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jrdiesel Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 Analog VSS: 2-5 Volts AC at slow speeds 5-8 Volts AC at 60MPH Digital VSS Ignition key on, but not running. 0 VDC= Not moving 5-12 VDC = Moving My book recommends jacking up the drive tire and rotating it manually. Upon reading further, most vehicles now will have a digital VSS, so your reading should be in VDC, unlike my previous answer when I said AC. Hope this helps, good luck. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GQRilla Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 You shouldn't have to jack up the vehicle to test for VSS. I've been testing it simply by driving forward (in a good sized parking lot) and watching the volt meter (DC) to look for a voltage fluctuation for a long time. As for the voice recognition for the bluetooth, just get used to manually dialing either by contact or use the phone. Some people make it work but most don't. Speaking the entire phone number also works but not as well as Pioneer would like you think. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kerosene Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 why even connect the vss, just use gps for speed... it works, I didn't attach the vss and works perfectly fine... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GQRilla Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 Absolutely yes. Speed sense is not necessary, but since the input is there, why not try? Gotta figure it makes stuff more accurate. At least for those who go thru tunnels a lot. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kerosene Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 tbh, I do... I drive a LOT and it's pretty good without the vss... and it's actually very accurate, i've been playing with it and the speeding notification, it is really accurate... I dont see a benefit to it, I heard from a guy on altimas.net about that... and i was sceptical also, but it is just like he said that it's not needed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rjnebbo Posted November 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 tbh, I do... I drive a LOT and it's pretty good without the vss... and it's actually very accurate, i've been playing with it and the speeding notification, it is really accurate... I dont see a benefit to it, I heard from a guy on altimas.net about that... and i was sceptical also, but it is just like he said that it's not needed. Yeah I hear what you are saying, however I hate paying for something then not using it. One of the reasons for going with the 900BT was that the 700BT DID NOT have the VSS wire. I also liked the idea of being able to play DVDs as well (a nice feature). Other than those two thing the 900BT is the same as the 700BT. If I am not going to use the VSS and the DVD is just a nice feature, then I should have opted for the 700BT So it is a matter of using what you paid for! Not only that, I was going to do all this myself rather than professionally done, as I am well capable, but wanted to treat myself to having someone else go through these hiccups. So what is this installing shop to do now when they install 900BT in other 2009 Rav4's? Not hook up a feature that the customer paid for? I think there should be some sort of responsibility here, just to telling the customer "Well it is not really needed anyway" is not acceptable. Granted it is not absolutely necessary. But it is a "Feature" that the consumer may have wanted. Just like the DVD is a Feature. Maybe I will find out that it is not possible on this vehicle, but at least I want to know WHY. Something to do with the Traction control tied into the VSS maybe? Or do I have a defective 900BT? All this has yet to be seen. I will get some time this weekend to figure it out. However without wiring diagrams for the vehicle makes it a challenge, as not know what all ties into the VSS sensor. Troubleshooting is a challenge. Thanks for all the input and I will be sure to let you know how it goes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BorisM Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 tbh, I do... I drive a LOT and it's pretty good without the vss... and it's actually very accurate, i've been playing with it and the speeding notification, it is really accurate... Try something like Lower Wacker Drive... Somehow I do not see it tracking aanywhere near accurate down there without VSS and gyro... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rjnebbo Posted November 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 TOTAL HACK JOB... I took out the head unit and started to inspect the handy work closer. I pulled the connectors of the back and the black one was tighter than normal. You see why! This wire just happens to be the PINK wire for the VSS! Coincidence? documented and took pictures... this is a poor install job... what a hack! I am going to show these guys the pics and see what they say. There is no reason for this. If there was a problem with the unit they should have gotten another one! It appears the PIN on the unit got pushed in somehow. I thought it was broken off, but looking through a magnifying glass I can see the beveled edges, so I think it got pushed in. Unless you guys say they are like this, but I doubt it, then why the need for the hack job? OR the unit (chassis) is not really a 900BT but a 700BT or 7010BT as.... get this the serial number on the unit is NOT the same as the warranty card they gave me. However on the face of the unit it says AVIC-900BT and it does play DVDs ??? go figure this one out. Someone has some explaining to do. Any input on how to handle this from you guys would be helpful. I did not go any further in testing the VSS Purple wires YET as I think I should get this resolved first. what you think ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kerosene Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 dude, if I were you I'd return it. 1. This is only what you see, they could have easly messed something else up... 2. Electronics, especially audio is easly messed up and it can cause damage to your vehicle... for all you know your car may be on fire right now... 3. You will never have the same quality of work done by someone as you would do it yourself. The wiring is not that hard, and I can walk you through it if you need it. -- Boris, so far I've driven downtown and havnt had issues, I dont think I was on wacker though... but there are circumstances, that shit is solid concrete all around Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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