Z2 Bypass, maybe there is something we can do...

[weberjam]

Quite honestly if only Pioneer Legal would write up a disclaimer absolving the company of any responsibility, shifting the responsibility of a potential distraction to the owner then as a result providing the software bypass. We'd be done with this nonsense and everybody would be happy.

This sparked an idea... (think "The Shawshank Redemption") What if we start an e-mail writing campaign? All of us should write Pioneer customer support, technical support and any other e-mail address we can find suggesting that their Legal department write a disclaimer that is displayed and must be agreed to when starting the vehicle (like the TomTom software does on my old GPS enabled PDA) to enable video and other features while driving. We should keep writing every day or so. We should include testimonials of why people aren't upgrading to the Z2 or that other systems are being considered because of this lack of functionality.

 

What do you guys think?

 

P.S. Even if it didn't work it would still give me great satisfaction to think of the mass of e-mails that they would have to deal with.

[T]

wont work

 

 

legal would never allow it. period.

 

it would potentionally cost way too much money

[weberjam]

The idea is to let them know it might cost them too much money if they don't (in lost sales). I think it is worth a try. Like I said if nothing else at least the annoyance factor that they'll experience will make up for the annoyance factor that we are experiencing with the lack of functionality.

 

44 people have viewed this post. If 44 people were e-mailing them on a near daily basis they would have to acknowledge the complaint somehow. Don't forget they are driven by sales of their product which is in turn driven by the satisfaction of their customers.

[BrokenLimits]

should have bought the Z1

[T]

The idea is to let them know it might cost them too much money if they don't (in lost sales). I think it is worth a try. Like I said if nothing else at least the annoyance factor that they'll experience will make up for the annoyance factor that we are experiencing with the lack of functionality.

 

44 people have viewed this post. If 44 people were e-mailing them on a near daily basis they would have to acknowledge the complaint somehow. Don't forget they are driven by sales of their product which is in turn driven by the satisfaction of their customers.

 

 

first of all, pioneer is not losing money at all on this product. In fact they are becoming hard to get a hold of, and a lot of times on backorder.

 

Secondly do you think that any of those emails will be read? If they are, will it be anyone important or that gives a damn?

[weberjam]

first of all, pioneer is not losing money at all on this product. In fact they are becoming hard to get a hold of, and a lot of times on backorder.

 

Secondly do you think that any of those emails will be read? If they are, will it be anyone important or that gives a damn?

 

Yes they will loose money if customers choose to go with a different unit from a different manufacturer. I didn't know they were hard to get a hold of. I got mine for $1550. I figured that they were plentiful if I could get such a deal.

 

Yes the e-mails will be read. Alone they won't be read by anyone who cares, but it a massive amount comes in from a group that are "AVIC" enthusiast then there is a better chance that they will sit up and take notice.

 

I understand that you don't think it will work and don't want to participate and that is fine, but unless you have a real reason why we shouldn't try except that it is likely to fail (which I freely admit), then your input is worthless.

[ducatiboy]

should have bought the Z1

 

You can always take out the hard drive and load the Z1's files on it and then bypass it like a Z1. That works.

[palacios]

In my opinion, it won't work. I do think after a while the people reading them will get pissed but it's very likely nothing will come of it. Even if 50 people were to read this and participate, do you really think Pioneer will care if they lose 50 customers? They might but considering they sell many thousands of these units in the U.S., it's likely that it won't bother them about the $70K they will lose out on. I know that sounds like a lot of money but it's nothing compared to what they actually make on them.

 

$70K is based on $1,400 X 50. Assuming Pioneer makes $1400 per unit.

[Julius]

It won't work,even if you have a disclaimer lawyers have ways of getting around them. If one person is killed watching a movie while driving can you image how much it will cost them if sued. Now multiply that one by thousands. It could cost them hundreds of millions. I understand what you are saying and thats cool but in today's society you have to look at it at a legal standpoint.

[Beachdoc]

This maybe a stupid question but why are stand alone units like Garmin and Tom Toms, etc. allowed to enter NAV info while driving? These companies aren't subject to any laws or standards that car OEM and factory NAV's are. Or am I missing something?

[weberjam]

In my opinion, it won't work. I do think after a while the people reading them will get pissed but it's very likely nothing will come of it. Even if 50 people were to read this and participate, do you really think Pioneer will care if they lose 50 customers? They might but considering they sell many thousands of these units in the U.S., it's likely that it won't bother them about the $70K they will lose out on. I know that sounds like a lot of money but it's nothing compared to what they actually make on them.

 

$70K is based on $1,400 X 50. Assuming Pioneer makes $1400 per unit.

Every customer that a business receives a complaint from can represent X number of customers that they are not being notified by about their dissatisfaction. Either way, your point is taken, without numbers behind this complaining, Pioneer will do nothing about it.

[weberjam]

This maybe a stupid question but why are stand alone units like Garmin and Tom Toms, etc. allowed to enter NAV info while driving? These companies aren't subject to any laws or standards that car OEM and factory NAV's are. Or am I missing something?

That was my point, that for Pioneer this is not legally and financially impossible (other companies are doing it). I feel that they don't think it is that big of an issue for their customers. My goal here was to organize some people to inform Pioneer that this is a big issue for us and we would like it fixed. I'm not advocating silly harassing e-mails. Just that we get everyone to let Pioneer know that they are not pleased about this and what they are considering as a result.

[BrokenLimits]

should have bought the Z1

 

You can always take out the hard drive and load the Z1's files on it and then bypass it like a Z1. That works.

 

Does that mean we have determined the bypass is completely software based? If so surely unlocking the drive and finding it somewhere in the software and then producing an "update" is in the future for this forum.

 

Come on computer whizzes

[palacios]

I feel that they don't think it is that big of an issue for their customers.

Well, look at it this way. They do know that attempts to bypass their units are made as soon as a new model is released. When we find the bypass, they are aware of it; or did you think they don't know about this website? Then when the next year's model is released, the same bypass no longer works (in some cases). We've been finding the bypass ever since the AVIC-N1 and it has changed almost every time the new model came out. I think they do know it's that big of an issue to us if we're so persistent model after model. They're just trying to cover their asses; that's why they keep changing it.

[ltl2007]

i think the z2's were flying off the shelf because nobody knew it didnt have a bypass yet. we sold 4 or 5 when they first came out, and since march havent sold ANY!! we are selling kenwood, eclipse, or even valor instead. Also, one of our distributors said that after about 6 months or so from a product release, they get weird "anonomous" faxes on how to do the bypasses. I wonder who they are from?? Pioneer? I think yes.